Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5   Go Down

Author Topic: Episode #242  (Read 1816 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

quirk3k

  • I meditate diligently every morning. The subject is Life and Love.
  • Frequent Poster
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2036
  • Nothing to see here... Move along
Re: Episode #242
« Reply #45 on: March 08, 2010, 07:55:40 AM »
Presumably then this is why objects heat up on re-entry - or to ask that another way does the body only begin to heat up (due to friction) when it reaches TV?  The potential energy which would go into accelaration goes into temperature instead?


The exact physics of this atmospheric braking are beyond my understanding of the physics, but I do know it's more than friction.

This link, Heat Shield Heating: Friction or Compression, says compression, friction, and a generated plasma combine to cause the heating.

Ok next question - if a lump o lead was carved to have the same shape as a feather and therefore the same wind resistance would it have a higher TV? due to a higher wieght? is wieght a factor in how fast things fall but merely as part of detemining drag? :-\


I don't know the answer to that.

I did some additional googling. Falling With Air Resistance says that mass does have an effect on air resistance.

Quote from: http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/phy05/phy05195.htm
Air resistance enters into the problem at once.  The bowling ball has
more mass (weight) per unit of surface area than the marble so it will
punch, if you will, through the air, far more effectively than the
marble.  The relationship between weight and surface area is very
important in deciding what fall faster.

A weird example would be: Which will fall faster, a feather or an exact
copy of that feather made of lead?  The lead feather, right?  It has
more weight per surface area.


Doh! I should have known this. Mass in a part of the velocity of a falling object equation.
Logged
Three thousand quirks and counting...

Trinoc

  • Frequent Poster
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2583
  • Vorsicht Mist!
Re: Episode #242
« Reply #46 on: March 08, 2010, 08:36:33 AM »
I'm sure I read somewhere that something the size of a mouse could fall an indefinite distance through air and still land slowly enough to avoid serious injury. The same would presumably apply to a frog or a small fish.
Logged
Be skeptical of the things you believe are false, but be very skeptical of the things you believe are true.

Citizen Wolf

  • Off to a Start
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 49
Re: Episode #242
« Reply #47 on: March 08, 2010, 08:51:48 AM »
A simplified view would be that Cows go splatt, People go crack & smash, Mice probably just bruise a bit and go EEK, and smaller things just bounce and run away.
Logged
The only thing I can be sure of is that I can't be sure of anything.

James

  • Keeps Priorities Straight
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 398
Re: Episode #242
« Reply #48 on: March 08, 2010, 09:02:46 AM »
A simplified view would be that Cows go splatt, People go crack & smash, Mice probably just bruise a bit and go EEK, and smaller things just bounce and run away.

Exactly, this is explained by the square-cube law which examines what happens when you scale things up or down; e.g.  if a human were scaled down to the size an ant, it could fall from any height and just walk away, unharmed.
Logged
A day without nuclear fusion is a day without sunshine.-MK

Faith is not a useful tool for discerning truth- Matt Dilahunty

Gib

  • Brand New
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1
Re: Episode #242
« Reply #49 on: March 08, 2010, 02:18:04 PM »
New question:

Steve mentions on this episode that a TENS machine is actually a helpful device for pain relief. I've investigated and come to the tenuous conclusion that it's just a placebo with an added piece of distraction (ie. when I stub my toe I forget about the itch on my nose).

My wife is giving birth in a month or two, and so this device is on my mind. Does anyone have any better information about just how good they are ?  Any good trials with them ?

Either way, I'll probably tell her to go for the hard drugs for the pain relief (have you seen the size of a baby's head!!!!??) but I'm interested in if these TENS machines really do work..
Logged

kem

  • Frequent Poster
  • ******
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 2870
Re: Episode #242
« Reply #50 on: March 08, 2010, 02:19:41 PM »
as any skydiver knows, terminal velocity is a moveable feast.  Cats will generally survive a seven storey fall as they reach a face to earth, stable falling position and have the anatomy to handle the fast braking. 

A skydiver in a stable face to earth position falls at about 200km/hr, an out of control spinning novice at about 50% faster whilst the experienced skydiver can exceed 300km/hr (and can translate most of that to horizontal velocity by changing body position).  Jumpers doing relative work alter their falling speed by adding weights, baggy suits and body position, and varying body types are suited for different positions in formations.

The terminal velocity of ants is less than 2m/second (5kph), perch???
Logged
This ain't no carnival ride, kid.  Burt Lancanster

kem

  • Frequent Poster
  • ******
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 2870
Re: Episode #242
« Reply #51 on: March 08, 2010, 02:22:44 PM »
Actually, I found the accupuncture sessions I received from my gp quite helpful, along with her help with meditation and advice on dealing with the both cancer, its effects and the rather heinous effectss of chemo and radiotherapy
Logged
This ain't no carnival ride, kid.  Burt Lancanster

Chew

  • Well Established
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1812
Re: Episode #242
« Reply #52 on: March 08, 2010, 03:37:41 PM »
The terminal velocity of ants is less than 2m/second (5kph), perch???


Using the numbers from Wikipedia and assuming a height of about 4 inches and a surface area coefficient of .75 and the fish falls lying on its side, about 15 m/s. That would be the minimum terminal velocity, assuming it fell from high enough to reach terminal velocity.
Logged
This is how it always begins, you know.  First they banned the trolls, and I said nothing, because I was not a troll...

stands2reason

  • Empiricist, Positivist, Militant Agnostic
  • Too Much Spare Time
  • ********
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7156
  • I'm a perfectly normal shrine maiden.
Re: Episode #242
« Reply #53 on: March 08, 2010, 04:00:42 PM »
All objects fall to earth at 9.8 meters per second per second (Sometimes written as 9.8 m/s/s or 9.8 m/s²). That is until an object reaches terminal velocity.


They would, if they were in a vacuum. Which they aren't.

All objects fall to earth at 9.8 meters per second per second (Sometimes written as 9.8 m/s/s or 9.8 m/s²). That is until an object reaches terminal velocity.


That would only be the case if an object started out with no no drag, then the drag suddenly equaled its gravitation pull at some velocity. As soon as an object starts moving through the atmosphere, it encounters drag. It's starts at 9.8 m/s2 the instant it starts moving, and from there is approaches 0 as it's velocity inrcreases.

Trinoc

  • Frequent Poster
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2583
  • Vorsicht Mist!
Re: Episode #242
« Reply #54 on: March 08, 2010, 04:26:15 PM »
I think there is a confusion between two views of acupuncture. First as a way of stimulating the nerves, which puts it in the same class as TENS (which may be a placebo as someone said, or may be a valid treatment as Steve said). Second there is the woo aspect.

There is no excuse for modern acupuncturists to talk about Qi and meridians, since these manifestly do not exist, but in the context of medical knowledge at the time it was invented they are probably as good a guess as could be expected. For all its errors, the meridian diagram looks superficially like a diagram of the nervous system, and not completely ridiculous considering there was none of the knowledge we have now about how nerves work.

The problem with acupuncture as practised in alt. med. is the refusal to update our understanding of how stimulation with needles could have an effect, just like any other nerve stimulation, and the insistence on regarding it as some sort of lost ancient wisdom which can only be understood in terms of the knowledge of the time.
Logged
Be skeptical of the things you believe are false, but be very skeptical of the things you believe are true.

quirk3k

  • I meditate diligently every morning. The subject is Life and Love.
  • Frequent Poster
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2036
  • Nothing to see here... Move along
Re: Episode #242
« Reply #55 on: March 08, 2010, 05:26:35 PM »
All objects fall to earth at 9.8 meters per second per second (Sometimes written as 9.8 m/s/s or 9.8 m/s²). That is until an object reaches terminal velocity.
That would only be the case if an object started out with no no drag, then the drag suddenly equaled its gravitation pull at some velocity. As soon as an object starts moving through the atmosphere, it encounters drag. It's starts at 9.8 m/s2 the instant it starts moving, and from there is approaches 0 as it's velocity inrcreases.


Picky picky.

The true acceleration is the force of gravity - drag force all divided by the mass.

The problem is saying objects fall at "mass * 9.8 m/s² - 1/2 * fluid density * velocity squared * projected area * coefficient of drag all divided by mass" makes people hate you.
« Last Edit: March 08, 2010, 07:51:24 PM by quirk3k »
Logged
Three thousand quirks and counting...

Voodoo Rage

  • Keeps Priorities Straight
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 277
Re: Episode #242
« Reply #56 on: March 08, 2010, 05:52:00 PM »

Qi

And a great way to get rid of a "q" in Scrabble, albeit in a highly questionable manner...
Logged

DoctorAtlantis

  • What?
  • Well Established
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1347
  • Hey Kids! It's Doctor Atlantis!
    • WWW
Re: Episode #242
« Reply #57 on: March 08, 2010, 08:14:14 PM »
I think fish are more, pardon, streamlined than mice.

Chew

  • Well Established
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1812
Re: Episode #242
« Reply #58 on: March 08, 2010, 09:31:31 PM »
I think fish are more, pardon, streamlined than mice.

That's a tough call. They kinda look aerodynamically similar.

(click to show/hide)

(click to show/hide)
Logged
This is how it always begins, you know.  First they banned the trolls, and I said nothing, because I was not a troll...

stands2reason

  • Empiricist, Positivist, Militant Agnostic
  • Too Much Spare Time
  • ********
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7156
  • I'm a perfectly normal shrine maiden.
Re: Episode #242
« Reply #59 on: March 08, 2010, 09:33:45 PM »
 :downsrim:
Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5   Go Up
« previous next »