Author Topic: Nuclear crisis in Japan at level 7  (Read 29584 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline neurotraveller

  • Seasoned Contributor
  • ****
  • Posts: 696
    • The Rationality Unleashed! Project
Re: Japan abandons stricken nuke plant over radiation
« Reply #15 on: March 16, 2011, 08:21:17 AM »
That's short for California or Cali Colombia?

California.
-Robert

http://rationalityunleashed.net/

"Leadership consists not in degrees of technique but in traits of character; it requires moral rather than athletic or intellectual effort, and it imposes on both leader and follower alike the burdens of self-restraint." - Lewis H. Lapham

Online Shibboleth

  • Stopped Going Outside
  • *******
  • Posts: 4851
Re: Japan abandons stricken nuke plant over radiation
« Reply #16 on: March 16, 2011, 08:30:39 AM »
Can't they just send in Kobayashi to eat the entire power plant?
common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools.

Offline Webbstre

  • Off to a Start
  • *
  • Posts: 28
Re: Japan abandons stricken nuke plant over radiation
« Reply #17 on: March 16, 2011, 10:08:12 AM »
They didn't abandon it, they just withdrew the workers temporarily to let it air out a bit at one point. They are back now. That's from the local news here in Japan, so I don't have a link.

Online Shibboleth

  • Stopped Going Outside
  • *******
  • Posts: 4851
Re: Japan abandons stricken nuke plant over radiation
« Reply #18 on: March 16, 2011, 10:14:48 AM »
They didn't abandon it, they just withdrew the workers temporarily to let it air out a bit at one point. They are back now. That's from the local news here in Japan, so I don't have a link.

You make it sound like someone broke wind. They had to leave due to a spike in radiation and are back now. The government increased the amount of radiation the workers are allowed to work under so I think it might be a combination of the radiation coming back down a little bit and the regulations being eased.
common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools.

Offline jaypee

  • Poster of Extraordinary Magnitude
  • **********
  • Posts: 19366
  • Astronaut Mike Dexter
Re: Japan abandons stricken nuke plant over radiation
« Reply #19 on: March 16, 2011, 10:15:05 AM »
I guess I would have the same reaction if they reported they all died.   Time for some hero action.  But where are the heroes?

We should send in Steven Seagal.

That would kill two birds with one stone.
"If I were an Algebra teacher I'd give everyone a letter grade but they'd have to figure out the value of the letter" -- A friend of mine

Offline Drewish

  • Banned
  • Reef Tank Owner
  • *
  • Posts: 9652
  • Am I freaking you out yet?
Re: Japan abandons stricken nuke plant over radiation
« Reply #20 on: March 16, 2011, 10:16:51 AM »
Okay, I know this won't be a global radiation thing, but how far is this likely to spread?  I mean how much of Japan could become a high infertility high leukemia zone?
WATCH OUT!

That picture of a kitten I posted is an underhanded emotional non-argument meant to turn you into a libertarian!

Online Shibboleth

  • Stopped Going Outside
  • *******
  • Posts: 4851
Re: Japan abandons stricken nuke plant over radiation
« Reply #21 on: March 16, 2011, 10:21:50 AM »
Okay, I know this won't be a global radiation thing, but how far is this likely to spread?  I mean how much of Japan could become a high infertility high leukemia zone?

From what I understand even with Chernoble they didn't see a big jump in leukemia. The greatest increase was in thyroid issues.
common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools.

Offline Chew

  • Reef Tank Owner
  • *********
  • Posts: 8938
  • Juror #8
Re: Japan abandons stricken nuke plant over radiation
« Reply #22 on: March 16, 2011, 10:34:49 AM »
The reason Chernobyl exploded was because of the materials that were used to cool the core. Daiichi does not have this same problem, and in addition, there are other measures in place to contain any potential fuel leakage. So, sorry, no poisonous gas cloud will be hovering over the horizon any time soon.

You are confusing "cooled" with "moderated". "Moderated" in the context of nuclear power means it slows down neutrons, enabling fission to occur. Chernobyl was water-cooled and graphite-moderated.

The explosion at Chernobyl blew the 2000 ton cap off. A containment building around that reactor would not have prevented the disaster it would become.

The reason Chernobyl exploded was a combination of many things. The graphite moderator fire helped spread the melted down fission byproducts over a much greater area than it would have if the graphite had not caught fire.
"3 out of 2 Americans do not understand statistics." -Mark Crislip

Online Belgarath

  • Captain Sugar Daddy
  • Too Much Spare Time
  • ********
  • Posts: 7904
Re: Japan abandons stricken nuke plant over radiation
« Reply #23 on: March 16, 2011, 11:52:13 AM »
Okay, I know this won't be a global radiation thing, but how far is this likely to spread?  I mean how much of Japan could become a high infertility high leukemia zone?

Possibly the plant itself, I would bet not much more than that, if even that.

Offline Chew

  • Reef Tank Owner
  • *********
  • Posts: 8938
  • Juror #8
Re: Japan abandons stricken nuke plant over radiation
« Reply #24 on: March 16, 2011, 12:13:35 PM »
Worst case scenario would be if the core melts, melts through the reactor vessel, the concrete base cannot contain it all, and the containment building fails from the heat. Stuff (lead and sand) would be dumped on it to reduce the spread of the fallout. An exclusion area of probably around 10 km would need to be set up around the plant for the next couple of hundred years.
"3 out of 2 Americans do not understand statistics." -Mark Crislip

Offline ♫♪ FX ♪♫

  • Earnest Young Man
  • Poster of Extraordinary Magnitude
  • **********
  • Posts: 16815
  • Plutonium is your friend!
    • Is it working?
Re: Japan abandons stricken nuke plant over radiation
« Reply #25 on: March 16, 2011, 12:18:16 PM »
     The plutonium fuel used in the one reactor means it's a lot longer than that.  But they certainly need to build a bigger tsunami wall.  Starting now.  There is no reason another tsunami won't be happening in the near future.
It is difficult to believe that a man is telling the truth when you know that you would lie if you were in his place. - H.L. Mencken

 “That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons history has to teach.” - Aldous Huxley

Offline Jeremy's Sea

  • Kintsukuroi, baby.
  • Well Established
  • *****
  • Posts: 1827
  • 667 - Neighbor of the beast.
    • bLog for a righter/musican
Re: Japan abandons stricken nuke plant over radiation
« Reply #26 on: March 16, 2011, 12:44:32 PM »
I guess I would have the same reaction if they reported they all died.   Time for some hero action.  But where are the heroes?

We should send in Steven Seagal.

That would kill two birds with one stone.

I'm so glad I read thru the thread before posting because I was going to say the exact same thing. Twins!

It's my understanding that the difference between the Japanese reactors and the Chernobyl reactor is that the reactors in Japan are inherently stable because of the water system and they just need to avert fission from occurring and the reactor at Chernobyl was inherently unstable because of the graphite type of management system.
I really hope they get this under control quickly, I would hate to see this kill off the nuclear industry. Though some applied lessons learned will be a very good thing!
Tipping cows in fields Elysian.

Online Shibboleth

  • Stopped Going Outside
  • *******
  • Posts: 4851
Re: Japan abandons stricken nuke plant over radiation
« Reply #27 on: March 16, 2011, 12:54:49 PM »
Every time they show the workers I am surprised that they aren't in white jump suits with white helmets. It's stupid because not once did I ever think that is what they actually wore.
common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools.

Offline Chew

  • Reef Tank Owner
  • *********
  • Posts: 8938
  • Juror #8
Re: Japan abandons stricken nuke plant over radiation
« Reply #28 on: March 16, 2011, 01:09:23 PM »
It's my understanding that the difference between the Japanese reactors and the Chernobyl reactor is that the reactors in Japan are inherently stable because of the water system and they just need to avert fission from occurring and the reactor at Chernobyl was inherently unstable because of the graphite type of management system.
I really hope they get this under control quickly, I would hate to see this kill off the nuclear industry. Though some applied lessons learned will be a very good thing!

To be more accurate, the Chernobyl reactors are inherently unstable at low power. Of course, it helps to hasten a disaster if you bypass every single safety system that was installed. Ironically, it was during a test to make the Chernobyl plant safer when the accident happened. The reactor tried to scram itself several times during the test but the operators overrode the safety systems.
"3 out of 2 Americans do not understand statistics." -Mark Crislip

Offline ♫♪ FX ♪♫

  • Earnest Young Man
  • Poster of Extraordinary Magnitude
  • **********
  • Posts: 16815
  • Plutonium is your friend!
    • Is it working?
Re: Japan abandons stricken nuke plant over radiation
« Reply #29 on: March 16, 2011, 01:29:48 PM »
       Now problems with other reactors at a different plant have been reported, and evacuation of that area is taking place.

    This shit just keeps getting worse.
It is difficult to believe that a man is telling the truth when you know that you would lie if you were in his place. - H.L. Mencken

 “That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons history has to teach.” - Aldous Huxley

 

personate-rain