Topic: Episode #334

[Anders]

Excuse me, rogues. Kevin Trudeau may be a crook, a fraud and/or a dangerous charlatan (allegedly), but that doesn't make him necessarily a psychopath or a sufferer from any other mental illness.

I'm sure Steve has criticised the practice of using mental illness as a general-purpose put-down for people we don't like in the past, but he seemed quite happy to go along with it this time.

He's a serial fraudster who doesn't appear to show any signs of remorse and who gets people to give money to him for all sorts of stupid reasons over and over again due to the power of his charisma. There are, if nothing else, definite parallels between that and psychopathic behavior.

I think that's a little harsh on Steve.

[Johnny Slick]

Are you kidding me? Neurosurgery isn't even a science. It's just something made up by Big Surgery to convince people to continue to send them money for working on peoples' so-called "brains".

[ufo]

So, realistically, Rebecca, when do you think I can buy a baby mammoth from Pets R Us for my back forty?  I'd like to start saving for that now! 

[ufo]

I got the noisy!  The first time ever that I managed to guess it!   It is piranha fish "barking", probably from the NewScientist magazine's video of the phenomenon.

[GodSlayer]

Excuse me, rogues. Kevin Trudeau may be a crook, a fraud and/or a dangerous charlatan (allegedly), but that doesn't make him necessarily a psychopath or a sufferer from any other mental illness.

I'm sure Steve has criticised the practice of using mental illness as a general-purpose put-down for people we don't like in the past, but he seemed quite happy to go along with it this time.

He's a serial fraudster who doesn't appear to show any signs of remorse and who gets people to give money to him for all sorts of stupid reasons over and over again due to the power of his charisma. There are, if nothing else, definite parallels between that and psychopathic behavior.

I think that's a little harsh on Steve.

are you kidding me? the way he crushes his opponents, he's heartless!

[MikeHz]

Excuse me, rogues. Kevin Trudeau may be a crook, a fraud and/or a dangerous charlatan (allegedly), but that doesn't make him necessarily a psychopath or a sufferer from any other mental illness.

I'm sure Steve has criticised the practice of using mental illness as a general-purpose put-down for people we don't like in the past, but he seemed quite happy to go along with it this time.

He may not be a psychopath, in the sense of one who actively seeks to harm others. But he is certainly a sociopath, which is someone who acts without regard for the interest or wellbeing of others.

[Trinoc]

Excuse me, rogues. Kevin Trudeau may be a crook, a fraud and/or a dangerous charlatan (allegedly), but that doesn't make him necessarily a psychopath or a sufferer from any other mental illness.

I'm sure Steve has criticised the practice of using mental illness as a general-purpose put-down for people we don't like in the past, but he seemed quite happy to go along with it this time.

He may not be a psychopath, in the sense of one who actively seeks to harm others. But he is certainly a sociopath, which is someone who acts without regard for the interest or wellbeing of others.

If you cast your net that wide then you've just classified all criminals with any kind of victim (thieves, con artists, etc.) as being mentally ill. Is this really the path you want to follow?

[seaotter]

Well I want to go that way. We should rehabilitate/treat criminals instead of pretending they are animals.

[Trinoc]

Well I want to go that way. We should rehabilitate/treat criminals instead of pretending they are animals.

Agreed, but that does not require the myth of treating criminal behaviour as an illness. Particularly if that means an illness for which the "patient" is coerced into receiving treatment. That way the Brave New World lies.

[Old Hoplite]

Excuse me, rogues. Kevin Trudeau may be a crook, a fraud and/or a dangerous charlatan (allegedly), but that doesn't make him necessarily a psychopath or a sufferer from any other mental illness.

I'm sure Steve has criticised the practice of using mental illness as a general-purpose put-down for people we don't like in the past, but he seemed quite happy to go along with it this time.

He's a serial fraudster who doesn't appear to show any signs of remorse and who gets people to give money to him for all sorts of stupid reasons over and over again due to the power of his charisma. There are, if nothing else, definite parallels between that and psychopathic behavior.

I think that's a little harsh on Steve.

are you kidding me? the way he crushes his opponents, he's heartless!

I'm reasonably sure that Dr. Novella has a functioning cardiovascular system.

[Johnny Slick]

Well I want to go that way. We should rehabilitate/treat criminals instead of pretending they are animals.

Agreed, but that does not require the myth of treating criminal behaviour as an illness. Particularly if that means an illness for which the "patient" is coerced into receiving treatment. That way the reality where we don't treat people as though they have a special "soul" which exists outside of the human body lies.

FTFY.

[Shadow Of A Doubt]

Well I want to go that way. We should rehabilitate/treat criminals instead of pretending they are animals.

Agreed, but that does not require the myth of treating criminal behaviour as an illness. Particularly if that means an illness for which the "patient" is coerced into receiving treatment. That way the reality where we don't treat people as though they have a special "soul" which exists outside of the human body kind of society where Alan Turing is ordered to undergo chemical castration lies.

FTFY.

Or what Trinoc said originally basically.

[Johnny Slick]

So homosexuality is as harmful to society as psychopathy?

[Caffiene]

Well I want to go that way. We should rehabilitate/treat criminals instead of pretending they are animals.

Agreed, but that does not require the myth of treating criminal behaviour as an illness. Particularly if that means an illness for which the "patient" is coerced into receiving treatment. That way the reality where we don't treat people as though they have a special "soul" which exists outside of the human body kind of society where Alan Turing is ordered to undergo chemical castration lies.

FTFY.

Or what Trinoc said originally basically.

So it was ok for homosexuality to be illegal, so long as we lock up all the homosexuals instead of "treating" them? (Which Turing actually had the choice of, btw - prison or hormone treatment)

No... The problem with having Alan Turing undergo chemical castration was not the link between crime and treatment. The problem was at the more basic level of what is considered a crime in the first place. We now realise that saying "homosexuality is not acceptable in society" was the error, regardless of how they tried to solve the "problem" once it was been identified.

[Shadow Of A Doubt]

OK that was a bad analogy. Still don't like forcing criminals to take chemicals - feels like a violation of bodily autonomy to me.