Author Topic: 1950s UFO cult stil lives  (Read 662 times)

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Offline mindme

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1950s UFO cult stil lives
« on: January 31, 2012, 08:27:43 AM »
Yes, people do still believe there are advanced civilizations on Venus and Mars. A friend and I went to a talk by an apparently thriving UFO cult that originated in the 1950s with a contactee named George King. I just had to meet someone who really believed there was a civilization. I was surprised at what I found. Not crazies. People who have never actually examined their "irrefutable proof". I did a, ohhhh, longish take down on the Skeptic North blog:

http://www.skepticnorth.com/2012/01/toronto-aetherius-society-jesus-venusians-and-some-bad-astronomy-part-1/
http://www.skepticnorth.com/2012/01/toronto-aetherius-society-his-masters-voice-stuff-that-goes-boom-and-a-lack-of-proof-part-2/
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Offline Obsequious

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Re: 1950s UFO cult stil lives
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2012, 08:40:50 PM »
That was a very entertaining read! I happen to be obsessed with Japanese sci-fi movies, and I've made an inquiry with an expert I know regarding whether The Mysterians was released in the UK, and what its release date might have been. I'll get back to you when I have his answer.

Reading this reminded me of a coworker I had back in the early-to-mid 1990s. He and I were both involved in the San Francisco Bay Area's burgeoning rave party scene at the time, and UFO and alien beliefs and imagery were very popular with that subculture. I'm sure you can imagine how a scene which centered around the use of ecstasy for the purposes of "consciousness expansion" would readily lend itself to a belief in glorious space brothers.

Anyway, this coworker of mine passionately believed in something called the Ashtar Command, and he would sit there and tell me, in all seriousness, that they had a "mother ship" which was in low Earth orbit. I was kind of surprised to learn this Ashtar Command business dated back to 1952, as the rave kids who'd embraced it had certainly dressed it up with very modern imagery and terminology.

Anyway...

Offline Obsequious

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Re: 1950s UFO cult stil lives
« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2012, 10:05:12 PM »
OK, Japanese sci-fi maven August Ragone, who is the author of Eiji Tsuburaya: Master of Monsters: Defending the Earth with Ultraman and Godzilla, has confirmed for me that The Mysterians did indeed receive a theatrical release in the UK in the late 1950s.

August didn't give me an exact release date, but that certainly puts the film in UK theaters, and available for King to have possibly viewed, prior to his April 7, 1960 Maldek revelation.

Offline mindme

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Re: 1950s UFO cult stil lives
« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2012, 08:39:27 AM »
OK, Japanese sci-fi maven August Ragone, who is the author of Eiji Tsuburaya: Master of Monsters: Defending the Earth with Ultraman and Godzilla, has confirmed for me that The Mysterians did indeed receive a theatrical release in the UK in the late 1950s.

August didn't give me an exact release date, but that certainly puts the film in UK theaters, and available for King to have possibly viewed, prior to his April 7, 1960 Maldek revelation.


Sweet! Thanks. I also seem to place King in the USA around the time the movie came out.
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Offline Obsequious

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Re: 1950s UFO cult stil lives
« Reply #4 on: February 03, 2012, 04:32:26 PM »
Well it looks like the Aetherians were only telling part of the truth. They neglected to mention the Venusian Scorpions:


Quote
An article published in the Solar System Research magazine reported Several objects resembling living beings were detected on photos made by a Russian landing probe in 1982 during a Venus mission.

Leonid Ksanfomaliti of the Space Research Institute of Russia’s Academy of Sciences published research that analyzed the photos from the Venus mission made by a Soviet landing probe, Venus-13, in 1982.

The photos feature several objects, which Ksanfomaliti said, resembled “a disk,” “a black flap” and “a scorpion.” All of them “emerge, fluctuate and disappear,” the scientist said, referring to their changing location on different photos and traces on the ground.

"What if we forget about the current theories about the nonexistence of life on Venus, let’s boldly suggest that the objects’ morphological features would allow us to say that they are living,” Solar System Research quoted Ksanfomaliti as saying.

No data proving the existence of life on Venus, where the ground temperature is 464 degrees Celsius (867 degrees Fahrenheit), has ever been found.


Offline mindme

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Re: 1950s UFO cult stil lives
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2012, 07:39:01 AM »
"Because the world needs more Mark Crislip."

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Offline Chew

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Re: 1950s UFO cult stil lives
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2012, 11:10:53 AM »
Heh. Adamski, the original Billy Meiers. He just didn't try hard enough. But he was very clever in hoaxing his videos.

A True Believer says Adamski's video shows an authentic alien spacecraft.
UFO Adamski footage Analysis!


How it was faked.
UFO - George Adamski footage Debunked


TL;DW: a piece of junk was glued to a window and the camera moved around to mimic the UFO's movement.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2012, 11:15:48 AM by Chew »
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Offline Obsequious

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Re: 1950s UFO cult stil lives
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2012, 05:34:41 PM »
I can't find anything in those pics that even remotely resembles a scorpion.

Offline mindme

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Re: 1950s UFO cult stil lives
« Reply #8 on: February 13, 2012, 09:37:28 AM »
I've done a lot of research about the far out claims people make about George King's titles. Added it on rational wiki:

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/The_Aetherius_Society#King.27s_Titles

(I wish Rational wiki was a bit more rational and not written in a kind of booya! language at times.)

Interestingly, the society itself seems to have stopped making claims about King's noble position. Maybe because it's illegal in Europe. Or maybe because people can easily google on some of these titles and discover they are utter bullshit.

(I posted a very polite request for comment on the Toronto Facebook page of the Aetherius society with links to my blog posts. Something long the lines of "I enjoy the talk. There were some interesting ideas even if I disagree. I'd enjoy some comment on my blog posts." The page's admin deleted it! Ha. It would seem irrefutable proof is fragile before actual research.)
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Offline Obsequious

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Re: 1950s UFO cult stil lives
« Reply #9 on: February 13, 2012, 02:45:30 PM »
That Rational Wiki page doesn't seem to want to load for me.

Offline mindme

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Re: 1950s UFO cult stil lives
« Reply #10 on: February 15, 2012, 07:57:18 AM »
That Rational Wiki page doesn't seem to want to load for me.

It was down for a bit that day.
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Offline Obsequious

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Re: 1950s UFO cult stil lives
« Reply #11 on: February 15, 2012, 03:43:27 PM »
Nice work! I think I'm going to update my resume to include my being awarded the "Prize of Peace and Justice" from The International Union of Christian Chivalry.

Offline mindme

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Re: 1950s UFO cult stil lives
« Reply #12 on: February 16, 2012, 10:51:41 AM »
Everyone should add that to their LinkedIn
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Offline mindme

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Re: 1950s UFO cult stil lives
« Reply #13 on: March 01, 2012, 10:13:54 AM »
Correspondence with a member of the society.

----------------------------------------------
A Guy
Feb 28 (1 day ago)
By the way, did anyone get back to you about the year Dr. King was made Chaplain?

----------------------------------------------
Karl Mamer
Feb 29 (1 day ago)
The year I think was in 1981?

Based on correspondence with the AFP&CC they don't have a chaplain
position other than a single national chaplain. The spokesperson said
the founder died and they did not have a record of chaplains other
than the last two who served. He stressed "We only appoint and utilize
one Chaplain." He also noted the founder had died several years ago
and institutional memory died with him. It is possible back in the
1980s there was a way to apply for a local chaplain position. I can't
find many people claiming a non-national chaplain position with the
AFP&CC other than the late Frank E.Stranges.

----------------------------------------------
A Guy
12:05 PM (23 hours ago)
Was that the information you were needing?

----------------------------------------------
Karl Mamer
1:20 PM (21 hours ago)
I'm just trying to reconcile the claim by the AFP that they only use
one chaplain and the society's claim King was a chaplain for the AFP.
These two claims seem at odds unless:

1) the spokesperson was mistaken
2) policy had changed previous to this spokesperson joining the AFP
and they appointed regional chaplains below the national level

I'm assuming if King was appointed the national chaplain for the AFP
then the Aetherius Society would have specified this more impressive
title on its King biography page.

The AFP seems to have no where to apply for a chaplain position. Their
membership application seems to allow anyone who is a concerned
citizen to join for $36 (http://www.aphf.org/afpmem.html) but there
appears to be no space on the application to register as a chaplain.
As well, they have, on their web site, no list of chaplains for the
AFP other than the national position. If this is an important position
within the AFP, it strikes me they would list regional chaplains so
people could make use of them in times of need.

Even the application form lists:

Who Makes Up our 100,000 Plus Members?

• Local Police
• Sheriffs and Deputy Sheriffs
• State Police and
• State Enforcement Officers
• Federal Agents, Federal Police Officers
• Security Officers
• Reserve Auxiliary Police
• Concerned Citizens
• Crime Watch Volunteers
• Supporters of the Second Amendment

But no reference to chaplains.

The King biography indicates the chaplain position was in "recognition
for his work". But If I can join an organization for $36 and then call
myself a chaplain it's not quite recognition for my work.

How does the society document this?

----------------------------------------------
A Guy
2:33 PM (20 hours ago)
Hi Karl,

I am aware of the current process of any citizen being able to have membership with the AFP for $36. This was certainly not the case with Dr. George King. As you were probably made aware, things/policies have changed since the 80's.

I personally have not spent many hours researching the Chaplain position, mainly because I took his word for it - I did not take Dr. George King to be a liar about such things, or an overstater. I have seen many pictures, awards, plaques, certificates over the past few years that have more than vivified his "worldly" achievements. Plus, I've read most of his major publications and they ring far too loud of truth (much of it coinciding and harmonizing with other metaphysical, religious and occult teachings) for any doubt to creep in my consciousness. But I will be honest with you and admit that at first, in my early months in The Aetherius Society, I did a lot scrutinizing, questioning (as opposed to asking questions), doubting, weighing, discriminating, and contemplation. A lot of my confirmations came mostly from an inner experience, an inner knowing and recognition, call it intuition or "gut" feeling, though it helps to gather the outer facts to give us somewhere to start our inner contemplations.

This is a little factoid that I came across in reference to the whole chaplain thing. It was published in the "Introduction To The Author" in Dr. King' book, "Visit to the Logos of Earth", pg. 15:
"In 1983 his name appeared in "Who's Who in American Law Enforcement," published by the American Police Academy, with full recognition of his title as Prince, for his work as adviser to American law enforcement agencies and the fact that he gave honors to certain distinguished police officers in an Order of Chivalry called the "Royal Knights of Justice," of which he was appointed as Deputy Grand Master. He was later appointed as an International Police Chaplain by the American Federation of Police."

Hope that helps.

I'd like to ask you a sincere question:
If Dr. King was indeed recognized by the AFP in the way he stated, would that change your opinion of his teachings and his life's service to the world?
Conversely, if the AFP did not recognize Dr. King in the way he stated, would that change your opinion of his teachings and service to the world?

----------------------------------------------
Karl Mamer
6:15 PM (16 hours ago)
>I am aware of the current process of any citizen being able to have membership with the AFP for $36. This was certainly not the case with Dr. George King. As you were probably made aware, things/policies have changed since the 80's.

I suggest that as a possibility but I have no information that the AFP
had a kind of regional chaplain program in times past. Even if they
had such a position, was it an honor in recognition of one's work or
simply something one can apply for and receive after paying a fee and
checking a box saying "chaplain".

The AFP itself seems rather suspect. Does one really want to claim an
honor by this organization? One can find many instances of real law
enforcement agencies warning against donating to the AFP, calling it a
scam:

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1914&dat=19900816&id=2TkpAAAAIBAJ&sjid=NmUFAAAAIBAJ&pg=4261,3066902
http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1298&dat=19920316&id=N-BLAAAAIBAJ&sjid=VYsDAAAAIBAJ&pg=6789,2544165

As well, Charity navigator gives the AFP its lowest ranking:

http://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=search.summary&orgid=6610

> "In 1983 his name appeared in "Who's Who in American Law Enforcement,"

There are many Who's Who compilations out there. Some will simply list
you and whatever short bio you provide for a fee without any vetting.
Maybe Who's Who in American Law Enforcement has a rigorous vetting
process or maybe it just bought the AFP mailing list and then offered
to include a bio for a fee. I have no information either way.

> If Dr. King was indeed recognized by the AFP in the way he stated, would
> that change your opinion of his teachings and his life's service to the
> world?

Not as such. I have too many questions about the claims the society
makes about his alleged honors. Maybe this is a good time to ask you
about his doctorate. I can find no place on the Aetherius site where
they list where he got his doctorate. A doctorate from a state
accredited educational insinuation is indeed a high honor and seems
well worth listing along with Prize of Peace and Justice from The
International Union of Christian Chivalry etc. In the book A Brief
Guide to Secret Religions the author states King received his
doctorate from "...the International Theological Seminary of
California, a degree mill with no accreditation...

http://books.google.ca/books?id=R_q2-Dbcf68C&pg=PA119&dq=Aetherius+king+doctor&hl=en&sa=X&ei=-itMT9zLJML30gGq8qjOAg&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q=Aetherius%20king%20doctor&f=false

By accreditation I mean the state of California has accredited it to
award degrees.

----------------------------------------------
A Guy
1:27 AM (9 hours ago)
I'm sorry you are troubled with the claims about Dr. King's alleged honors. None of them were falsified, if that's what you are wondering, nor did Dr. King, or any of the Members lie about his recognition. If anything, they were understated. Though, his worldly accreditation was not by any means a way of judging his teachings. It was, I believe, a way for the outside way to see Dr. King as not some far-out "wacky" individual and that he was indeed a distinguished and honorable man, in many circles of life. Nevertheless, the true measure of this man was not his honors or awards by the APF or a seminary, the true measure of this man was the teachings that he brought through his yogic mediumship and the Cosmic Missions he devised in cooperation with the Cosmic Masters, using his own invented radionic apparatuses.

Perhaps the best proof for you, regarding his recognition, would be to take a look at the certificates, diplomas, brevets and medals first hand? Because as you are kind of pointing out, what does it matter if he or anyone else in the Society wrote it? You are more than welcome to come to our Headquarters here in Los Angeles where most of all his possessions are still kept safely. I would be more than happy to give you a tour of the grounds, show you some of our archives, introduce you to his wife and the current International Directors who spent decades working by the side of Dr. King. I believe you would get a better feel and understanding of George King, the man and the Master, and The Aetherius Society, if you go to the source, as they say.


----------------------------------------------
Karl Mamer
8:49 AM (2 hours ago)
>I'm sorry you are troubled with the claims about Dr. King's alleged honors. None of them were falsified, if that's what you are wondering,

Not falsified but they appear to be either meaningless (a knighthood
awarded by a convicted fraudster) or not what the common person would
assume (a doctorate awarded via a state accredited school with a known
and difficult curriculum vs a diploma mill). When a man or a society
seems, in my opinion, to misrepresent basic accomplishments, it is
natural to be skeptical of all claims.

> Nevertheless, the true measure of this man was not his honors or awards by
> the APF or a seminary, the true measure of this man was the teachings that
> he brought through his yogic mediumship and the Cosmic Missions he devised
> in cooperation with the Cosmic Masters, using his own invented radionic
> apparatuses.

Radionics itself is a field rife with hucksters peddling entirely
bogus medical devices:

http://www.skepdic.com/radionics.html
http://www.quackwatch.org/04ConsumerEducation/News/rife.html

The society claims King was a world renowned expert in the field of
radionics (http://aetherius.org.nz/store/pendulums/) but provides no
evidence to support that claim. I could claim to be a world renowned
expert in radionics too. How do we decide who is telling the truth?

> Perhaps the best proof for you, regarding his recognition, would be to take
> a look at the certificates, diplomas, brevets and medals first hand?

I could, technically, but I've made a very earnest attempt to verify
such claimed honors online and each honor has rung hollow. Is this a
profitable use of my time? It's like saying "I keep trying to get
Online Book Company to deliver a book but each time I order a book it
never arrives. I'm suspecting Online Book Company is misrepresenting
itself and does not offer what it claims it offers. I could go down to
their warehouse in Seattle and see for myself they have a warehouse
and are expediting books. Maybe I'm just the unlucky one who has had 5
non-deliveries in a row. But my time is limited and there are so many
other companies offering me online books. I'll simply try one of
those."

I hope this has not soured you on responding to the blog posts. When I
do a google search on "Aetherius" I can see my blog post comes up on
the first page (via google.com, via non-personal results). Many people
searching for more information about your society will see
unchallenged critical claims. As I note in the first post:

||My own bias had me imagining someone not unlike Mork & Mindy‘s
Exidor. (Exidor, like so many UFO contactees of the 1950s, was hung up
on the notion of Venusian saviors.)

Jaggard turned out not to be
----------------------------------------------
A Guy in a dirty cassock. Jaggard, one of
the founding members of the Toronto Aetherius Society, was an
extremely dapper man in his mid-fifties. Jaggard wore a nicely
tailored dark suit, blue shirt, and a perfectly coordinated tie. Your
classic Harry Rosen man. George Hrab could take sartorial lessons from
him. His public persona was as polished and pleasing as his dress. The
talk ran about 3 hours with a short break. If this had been a
university night course, it would have been agony but Jaggard was such
an engaging speaker one barely noticed the passage of time.||

And

||I came to the talk hoping to point out to Jaggard we’ve actually
been to Mars and Venus with landers and found conditions quite
inhospitable to humanoid life. It was naive of me to think Jaggard had
never heard of this objection before. ||

As you can see, I admit a couple biases I had up front before the talk
and was delighted that they were challenged and I learned something. I
have no doubt my two lengthy blog posts have many other assumptions
and biases that have escaped my notice because, after all, I'm human.
Science tries to eliminate this via peer review. Scientists tend to be
very close to their own work and simply honestly miss thing.
Scientists value and appreciate such peer review that teases out their
own biases.
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Offline Obsequious

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Re: 1950s UFO cult stil lives
« Reply #14 on: March 01, 2012, 05:13:28 PM »
I almost feel sorry for the guy.

 

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