Topic: HFCS to Corn Sugar "RAGE!!" Ensues.

[mindme]

Natural News claims it's killin' the bees!

http://www.naturalnews.com/035610_honey_bees_pesticides_corn_syrup.html

Studies linking neonicotinoid pesticides to Colony Collapse Disorder (CCD), a condition in which entire bee colonies suddenly disappear or die, have been gaining national attention in recent months as they continue to flood scientific journals. But one area that has been largely overlooked is the role high-fructose corn syrup (HFCS) plays in killing off bees, as the vast majority of it comes from genetically-modified (GM), pesticide treated corn crops.

NN gives scan details and uses a lot of tortured language to imply HFCS farming is killing bees. Science says so! They entreat readers to read the study themselves. But they know not many will.

http://www.bouldercountybeekeepers.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Lu-final-proof1.pdf

Reading the study, farmers who FEED HFCS directly to their bees might be killing their bees if the HFCS has trace amounts of a pesticide (at levels not thought lethal).

This in situ study was designed to replicate CCD based on a plausible mechanistic hypothesis in which the occurrence of
CCD since 2006 was resulted from the presence of imidacloprid, one of the neonicotinoid insecticides, in high-fructose corn syrup
(HFCS), fed to honey bees as an alternative to sucrose-based food.

Really, they feed bees manually? I guess so:

http://www.honeybeeworld.com/misc/syrup/feed.htm

Also the original paper makes no reference to HFCS from a GMO crop. They just threw that in to make it sound even mutha fukin' scarier 'n' shit. What dishonest assholes.

It's odd places like NN will cast doubt on any study coming out of academia because "big pharma gives them lots of money!" And yet here's a study out of... academia they cherry pick (incorrectly even) to support their POV. Can't have it both ways, ya know.

[lonely moa]

one study of sugar and addiction.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2235907/?tool=pmcentrez

[lonely moa]

Natural News claims it's killin' the bees!

http://www.naturalnews.com/035610_honey_bees_pesticides_corn_syrup.html

Studies linking neonicotinoid pesticides to Colony Collapse Disorder (CCD), a condition in which entire bee colonies suddenly disappear or die, have been gaining national attention in recent months as they continue to flood scientific journals. But one area that has been largely overlooked is the role high-fructose corn syrup (HFCS) plays in killing off bees, as the vast majority of it comes from genetically-modified (GM), pesticide treated corn crops.

NN gives scan details and uses a lot of tortured language to imply HFCS farming is killing bees. Science says so! They entreat readers to read the study themselves. But they know not many will.

http://www.bouldercountybeekeepers.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Lu-final-proof1.pdf

Reading the study, farmers who FEED HFCS directly to their bees might be killing their bees if the HFCS has trace amounts of a pesticide (at levels not thought lethal).

This in situ study was designed to replicate CCD based on a plausible mechanistic hypothesis in which the occurrence of
CCD since 2006 was resulted from the presence of imidacloprid, one of the neonicotinoid insecticides, in high-fructose corn syrup
(HFCS), fed to honey bees as an alternative to sucrose-based food.

Really, they feed bees manually? I guess so:

http://www.honeybeeworld.com/misc/syrup/feed.htm

Also the original paper makes no reference to HFCS from a GMO crop. They just threw that in to make it sound even mutha fukin' scarier 'n' shit. What dishonest assholes.

It's odd places like NN will cast doubt on any study coming out of academia because "big pharma gives them lots of money!" And yet here's a study out of... academia they cherry pick (incorrectly even) to support their POV. Can't have it both ways, ya know.

For honeybees, the dose doesn't have to be lethal in the sense of directly killing them.  Neonicotinoids are hypothesised to misdirect their navigation which becomes secondarily fatal.  Those studies are only recently done outside and the (British) researcher I heard interviewed here was looking at bumblebees, another important pollinator.  The hypothesis that BT (systemic in GE plants) is certainly plausible.

[Ah.hell]

That may be the case as well (I'm just recalling stuff, OKAY!?), but it shouldn't be really surprising if a 5-pound dog eats a 10-ounce chocolate bar and then barfs all over the place. That would be like a human eating something like 19 pounds of chocolate in one sitting, which I'm pretty sure is going to have a very detrimental effect.

This always bothered.  The scary warnings about not feeding your dog chocolate but when you look up how much is actually needed to make them sick.   

[pandamonium]

RE: things that kill dogs--
"Grapes and raisins aren't the only people foods known to be dangerous to man's best friend. Chocolate and cocoa can prove deadly to them, as can onions and macadamia nuts."-- http://www.snopes.com/critters/crusader/raisins.asp

 http://www.snopes.com/critters/crusader/cocoamulch.asp-- "Cocoa beans contain the stimulants caffeine and theobromine. Dogs are highly sensitive to these chemicals, called methylxanthines. In dogs, low doses of methylxanthine can cause mild gastrointestinal upset (vomiting, diarrhea, and/or abdominal pain); higher doses can cause rapid heart rate, muscle tremors, seizures, and death.

Eaten by a 50-pound dog, about 2 ounces of cocoa bean mulch may cause gastrointestinal upset; about 4.5 ounces, increased heart rate; about 5.3 ounces, seizures; and over 9 ounces, death. (In contrast, a 50-pound dog can eat up to about 7.5 ounces of milk chocolate without gastrointestinal upset and up to about a pound of milk chocolate without increased heart rate.)"

these don't kill humans, so therefore vegan.

[superdave]

I was in the supermarket yesterday and tried to find foods that Lustig would approve of.  You really don't realize how much sugar is added to everything until you look at the labels.  Yogurt (at least the major american brands) is practically melted ice cream.   I am going to give his diet a shot.  I am not sure I buy all the toxin stuff but I can't see how cutting my sugar intake is a bad idea.

[Johnny Slick]

I have to watch the carb count and as such can recommend Greek yogurt if you're looking for something low(er) in sugar content. Heck, a pack of M&Ms has less carbs than a cup of yogurt.

[DeepGlue]

I think we should rename "sugar" to "stuff that turns into 50/50 HFCS in the first step of metabolic breakdown." That would clarify the whole issue.

[Skepdad]

I think we should rename "sugar" to "stuff that turns into 50/50 HFCS in the first step of metabolic breakdown." That would clarify the whole issue.

That's too funny ... or "stuff that turns to 50/50 HFCS in your gut" but I'm not sure it doesn't happen sooner.

[Halleyscomet/Wakefield]

The Archies - Sugar, Sugar (Original 1969 Music Video)

I have encountered more than one person who decried the monstrous effects of HFCS, yet buys prestige priced "Crystalline Fructose" as their preferred sweetener.

[lonely moa]

I was in the supermarket yesterday and tried to find foods that Lustig would approve of.  You really don't realize how much sugar is added to everything until you look at the labels.  Yogurt (at least the major american brands) is practically melted ice cream.   I am going to give his diet a shot.  I am not sure I buy all the toxin stuff but I can't see how cutting my sugar intake is a bad idea.

The problem with plain (nothing added) youghurt here in NZ is that it disappears first from the shelves, at least in my district.  The three best brands are also  made from whole fresh milk, no added dried milk solids and one of them  (our favourite)from (pasturised) milk and fermemted in a plant adjacent to the milking carousel. one can buy it in a 2 kg bucket.

I think Lustig has made the case rather well with regards to fatty liver disease and fructose and alchohol.  And the solution as well, just eat whole fruit.

[Shadow Of A Doubt]

I agree with allowing hfcs to be called corn sugar,  but I hate this issue. 
Yes, we eat too much sugar and hfcs, no hfcs is not poison.  Why do people act like it is all or nothing?

What, are you also proposing some magical colour midway between black and white?  Shall we call it "whack", maybe, or "blite"?  Nice imagination there, buddy.

In keeping with the traditions of these forums: I have added that to my signature. 

[pandamonium]

I was in the supermarket yesterday and tried to find foods that Lustig would approve of.  You really don't realize how much sugar is added to everything until you look at the labels.  Yogurt (at least the major american brands) is practically melted ice cream.   I am going to give his diet a shot.  I am not sure I buy all the toxin stuff but I can't see how cutting my sugar intake is a bad idea.

yeah, which is why I smirk whenever I see parents handing their kid juice but denying them soda. granted, at least juice has some nutritional value. but it's calorie packed and full of sugar. a typical bottle of juice is something like 150-200 calories. (iirc, I haven't looked at a juice label in a while. I usually drink water at work)

[Anders]

How many calories is there in beer?

[pandamonium]

How many calories is there in beer?

depends on the beer. the pale ale I had last night was ~160. a stout would've been ~220.