Author Topic: Battlestar Galactica  (Read 39375 times)

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Offline KarenX

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Battlestar Galactica
« on: July 29, 2008, 12:42:29 AM »
OK. All things BSG, I guess. Considering that all the episodes have been shown, I guess there are no spoilers for the episodes we've already seen--not technically--but some people may still be catching up, and might hope to avoid them. Let your conscience be your guide about warning people. For the new episodes, please post spoiler warnings. No extreme measures are necessary--just a head's up.

I have a spoilery question; a couple actually...

1) Helo and Athena on the Demetrius. Was it ever even mentioned, especially with regret or disappointment, that they are both the parents of the baby that had been stolen from them for the first year of her life, and that it was odd they were both on this mission? I can't imagine either of them ever letting Hera out of their sight again, but then there they are for two months on a dangerous escapade not even wondering about it. I can imagine even less that she would have been brought along.

2) Callie out the airlock. I could see why she would toss the baby out, but why herself, too? (I know she was drug addled, but that doesn't seem like quite enough of a reason.) Just because she hated the baby but loved the baby? Because she didn't want to deal with getting caught or living with herself?

She threw up once in that episode, at the bar, and then made some later reference to having a doctor's appointment. Well, the minute Athena threw up once on Caprica I knew she was pregnant--it's TV code for pregnant. Was Callie pregnant and thought--in her drug-addled state--that she had to go out the airlock, too, rather than bring another Cylon to life?

3) With all the kinky shit Baltar and Caprica Six were doing before the Cylons attacked the colonies, I can't believe that he never once saw her spine glow. I know that's a dropped plot point, but I don't keep up with extras and interviews. Have the producers ever brought up this topic?

4) No way Starbuck would beat Hot Dog in real life in a boxing match, right?
« Last Edit: July 29, 2008, 11:53:07 AM by KarenX »

Offline Neutral Milk

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Re: Battlestar Galactica
« Reply #1 on: July 29, 2008, 12:43:56 AM »
Considering that all the episodes have been shown,

There's still half a season left

Offline IrishJazz

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Re: Battlestar Galactica
« Reply #2 on: July 29, 2008, 07:54:39 AM »
OK. All things BSG, I guess. Considering that all the episodes have been shown, I guess there are no spoilers--not technically--but some people may still be catching up. Let your conscience be your guide about warning people.

I have a spoilery question; a couple actually...

1) Helo and Athena on the Demetrius. Was it ever even mentioned, especially with regret or disappointment, that they are both the parents of the baby that had been stolen from them for the first year of her life, and that it was odd they were both on this mission? I can't imagine either of them ever letting Hera out of their sight again, but then there they are for two months on a dangerous escapade not even wondering about it. I can imagine even less that she would have been brought along.

2) Callie out the airlock. I could see why she would toss the baby out, but why herself, too? (I know she was drug addled, but that doesn't seem like quite enough of a reason.) Just because she hated the baby but loved the baby? Because she didn't want to deal with getting caught or living with herself?

She threw up once in that episode, at the bar, and then made some later reference to having a doctor's appointment. Well, the minute Athena threw up once on Caprica I knew she was pregnant--it's TV code for pregnant. Was Callie pregnant and thought--in her drug-addled state--that she had to go out the airlock, too, rather than bring another Cylon to life?

3) With all the kinky shit Baltar and Caprica Six were doing before the Cylons attacked the colonies, I can't believe that he never once saw her spine glow. I know that's a dropped plot point, but I don't keep up with extras and interviews. Have the producers ever brought up this topic?

4) No way Starbuck would beat Hot Dog in real life in a boxing match, right?

In response:
1. People seem to get over things pretty quickly in the BSR universe. Athena can be a mind-tripping assassin in one episode and trusted member of the crew a short time later. From the  commentaries, Helo was a last minute addition to the garbage scow mission, so Hera wasn't even a consideration.
2. Suicidal Callie was a lot more ambiguous to airlock than a semi-rational Callie. The pregnancy, if intended, would have to have been detected before now so that is probably out.
3. The way the story is developing, Cylons and humans are a converging species, so the glowing backbon idea wasn't dropped as much as run away from. There was also a Cylon marker in the blood that Baltar used to detect Boomer in the first season that has been dropped. Also, whatever propblems they Cylones had vrom being inside a nebula. I may be wrong, but I don't think we will see these issues raised again.

I think there is some relationship between Head 6, Head Baltar and the returned Starbuck. But that may just be a desire to have the whole thing tied together into a coherent package. Endings are always difficult, especially if you are essentially ad libbing.
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Offline carrotflowers

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Re: Battlestar Galactica
« Reply #3 on: July 29, 2008, 09:08:00 AM »
An interesting way to gain some insight about what the producers etc are keeping in mind is to listen to Ron Moore's podcast. I've listened to all of the S1 - 3 podcasts, although I have found them less interesting in S4. But they are very neat, you get a lot of information about writer's decision, producer's decisions, director's decisions, why stuff was cut, what was cut.

For example in the episode where Adama gave Starbuck the Demetrius they had planned and maybe even shot Bill going up in her pristine raptor, flying around, shooting the guns, and yelling in a primeval way. Then he presented her the Demetrius.
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Offline stonesean

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Re: Battlestar Galactica
« Reply #4 on: July 29, 2008, 10:15:02 AM »
Quote
4) No way Starbuck would beat Hot Dog in real life in a boxing match, right?

This is always a peeve of both me and my wife. 

Any number of television shows (BSG, Alias, a million cop shows) feature scenes in which a female character played by a size zero wearing, 95 lb actress will be able to take punches from and defeat in a fight, some 200 pound guy. Even though, like in the case of Starbuck and Hot Dog, they have basically the same physical fitness level.  Absurd.   Dear "Mr. and Mrs. Smith", all else being equal Angelina Jolie simply can't beat Brad Pitt in a fistfight.  It's not sexism, it's not gender bias, it's physics.

That aside:  I think the spine glowing was simply a device to show us, the (at that point) rookie audience, that she ain't human.  Something they wisely dropped later.

The only thing I know for sure is that it CANT be Baltar.

If it was, it would negate a theme that ran from the first episode to the most recent.  Baltar's crushing guilt for nearly causing the extinction of the human race.

I'm also fairly certain it can't be Roslyn.  She was "cured" of her disease (temporarily) by cylon blood.  If she were a cylon, why would cylon blood cure her?

I'd like it to be Gaeta, or the Doc.  I'm not quite sure why though.

However, now that they are all mortal, does it even matter who the cylons are?

PS: They aren't on Earth.  They will NEVER find Earth.  It's kind of the point of the story.  Even with the show ending, they won't find Earth.

Well.  There it is.

Offline IrishJazz

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Re: Battlestar Galactica
« Reply #5 on: July 29, 2008, 10:19:39 AM »
An interesting way to gain some insight about what the producers etc are keeping in mind is to listen to Ron Moore's podcast. I've listened to all of the S1 - 3 podcasts, although I have found them less interesting in S4. But they are very neat, you get a lot of information about writer's decision, producer's decisions, director's decisions, why stuff was cut, what was cut.

For example in the episode where Adama gave Starbuck the Demetrius they had planned and maybe even shot Bill going up in her pristine raptor, flying around, shooting the guns, and yelling in a primeval way. Then he presented her the Demetrius.

Seconded. These are what I referred to in my previous post as "commentaries."  They work pretty well as just audio, if you remember the episode. Except for the ones with the actor who plays Remo Lampkin- cool guy but he just seems to be having fun and has little insight into the mythology of the series.
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Offline KarenX

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Re: Battlestar Galactica
« Reply #6 on: July 29, 2008, 11:42:43 AM »
I do listen to the podcasts, and I do agree about the seasons 1-3 being better than the season 4. I know that Helo was a last minute decision, but if these actors are as in tune with the characters as Moore says they are (and as they seem to be on screen) you'd think one of them could have said something about Hera on the Demetrius, especially during the conversation about if Helo should leave the rendezvous point without them or not. And Ronald Moore can't talk about everything during the podcast; I was hoping he'd mentioned it somewhere else.

And I am really, really not a person to quibble about plot points and I am very, very easy to entertain. But it strikes me as hilarious that it took them so long to figure out they should send a single ship out to the base star while everyone waits behind, when the Demetrius is a single ship sent to pursue the base star while the rest of the fleet stays behind! It's like a little fractal.

Mostly finding things like these make me feel like a savvy and intelligent viewer, when I am actually not. I also don't even mind the stand-alone episodes that probably broke up the rhythm of season 3, because I watched them in a row on DVD. But if I were to rewatch the whole series, I don't think I'd necessarily watch every episode, or at least not every scene of them.

Offline IrishJazz

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Re: Battlestar Galactica
« Reply #7 on: July 29, 2008, 11:51:41 AM »
I do listen to the podcasts, and I do agree about the seasons 1-3 being better than the season 4. I know that Helo was a last minute decision, but if these actors are as in tune with the characters as Moore says they are (and as they seem to be on screen) you'd think one of them could have said something about Hera on the Demetrius, especially during the conversation about if Helo should leave the rendezvous point without them or not. And Ronald Moore can't talk about everything during the podcast; I was hoping he'd mentioned it somewhere else.

And I am really, really not a person to quibble about plot points and I am very, very easy to entertain. But it strikes me as hilarious that it took them so long to figure out they should send a single ship out to the base star while everyone waits behind, when the Demetrius is a single ship sent to pursue the base star while the rest of the fleet stays behind! It's like a little fractal.

Mostly finding things like these make me feel like a savvy and intelligent viewer, when I am actually not. I also don't even mind the stand-alone episodes that probably broke up the rhythm of season 3, because I watched them in a row on DVD. But if I were to rewatch the whole series, I don't think I'd necessarily watch every episode, or at least not every scene of them.

The Demetrius was a complex ship... maybe they had Hera stuffed on top of a pipe, nearby but safely out of sight.  And to totally nerd out, they were trying to find earth... the base star was just part of the vast unseen cosmic plan. (There is a lot of stuff left for the show to explain... I saw an interview with Grace Park where she said she had to have the series ending explained to her a couple of times before she got it.)

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Offline carrotflowers

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Re: Battlestar Galactica
« Reply #8 on: July 29, 2008, 12:08:57 PM »
I do listen to the podcasts, and I do agree about the seasons 1-3 being better than the season 4. I know that Helo was a last minute decision, but if these actors are as in tune with the characters as Moore says they are (and as they seem to be on screen) you'd think one of them could have said something about Hera on the Demetrius, especially during the conversation about if Helo should leave the rendezvous point without them or not. And Ronald Moore can't talk about everything during the podcast; I was hoping he'd mentioned it somewhere else.

And I am really, really not a person to quibble about plot points and I am very, very easy to entertain. But it strikes me as hilarious that it took them so long to figure out they should send a single ship out to the base star while everyone waits behind, when the Demetrius is a single ship sent to pursue the base star while the rest of the fleet stays behind! It's like a little fractal.

Mostly finding things like these make me feel like a savvy and intelligent viewer, when I am actually not. I also don't even mind the stand-alone episodes that probably broke up the rhythm of season 3, because I watched them in a row on DVD. But if I were to rewatch the whole series, I don't think I'd necessarily watch every episode, or at least not every scene of them.

I agree with you about the Hera inconsistency though, because they made such a big deal of it in S1 & 2 - the child, the dreams etc, and getting her back from the cylons. Then we never saw her again. It feels like they work her back into the story at convenience or on a whim and continuity be damned to hell. They also made a HUGE deal of Hera even existing then just threw another hybrid baby into the mix with no fanfare whatsoever.

At this point the show is laden with enough inconsistency and continuity issues that I just ignore them to keep enjoying it. The overall story has been developed on the fly, and it shows.
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Offline sketchy

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Re: Battlestar Galactica
« Reply #9 on: July 29, 2008, 01:04:18 PM »
Also, whatever propblems they Cylones had from being inside a nebula. I may be wrong, but I don't think we will see these issues raised again.
Were some of the 4 in the nebula?  It's been a while -- but I'm guessing that it only affected the higher (earlier) models and the final 4 were not affected.

Offline sketchy

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Re: Battlestar Galactica
« Reply #10 on: July 29, 2008, 01:08:10 PM »
did anyone catch the windows error on the cylon background display a few episodes ago?  I think it was when they boarded the damaged cylon ship.  I think I have a pic on my computer.

Offline carrotflowers

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Re: Battlestar Galactica
« Reply #11 on: July 29, 2008, 01:09:41 PM »
No, I didn't. plz post it if you have it!
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Offline Belgarath

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Re: Battlestar Galactica
« Reply #12 on: July 29, 2008, 01:12:15 PM »
Also, whatever propblems they Cylones had from being inside a nebula. I may be wrong, but I don't think we will see these issues raised again.
Were some of the 4 in the nebula?  It's been a while -- but I'm guessing that it only affected the higher (earlier) models and the final 4 were not affected.

The final FIVE were all in the nebula.  BUT they were not there very long.  Remember many cylons showed up to rescue Leobin and they didn't show ill effects.  Apparently it takes some time for them to show symptoms.


On another note, I'm still sticking with Lee Adama or Bill Adama being the final cylon.
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Offline IrishJazz

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Re: Battlestar Galactica
« Reply #13 on: July 29, 2008, 01:12:37 PM »
BTW...  http://www.scifi.com/comiccon/video/index.php?clip=4 - ComicCon panel.

My understanding was that New Caprica in a nebula, shielded from the Cylons until they showed up with no ill effects.
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Offline sketchy

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Re: Battlestar Galactica
« Reply #14 on: July 29, 2008, 01:16:10 PM »
BTW...  http://www.scifi.com/comiccon/video/index.php?clip=4 - ComicCon panel.

My understanding was that New Caprica in a nebula, shielded from the Cylons until they showed up with no ill effects.
perhaps they programmed it out of their systems.  New Caprica as supposed to be safe