Topic: Podcast Topic suggestions

[curlew]

I agree that the invasion of quackery into academic medicine is a major problem. I have volunteered to serve on an Institutional Review Board (IRB) as a non-scientific community member, which has allowed me the opportunity to criticize some of the more biased studies of acupuncture and similar unscientific "treatments".

For those in the audience who are unaware of what an IRB is, it is the basic approver of all human subject research in any academic institution like a medical school or hospital. By law all human research must be approved by an IRB, which needs non scientific, unaffiliated community members to have a quorum. Since volunteers of this type are not that easy to find, most institutions are happy to get volunteers in this category.

My experience to date has been fascinating as a learning opportunity, but also as a chance to point out how badly flawed certain studies are. While I can't discuss specifics since the meetings are covered by non-disclosure, I think my participation has already prevented some badly flawed "alternative" studies from seeing the light of publication.

It might be useful to have a segment about IRBs on a future show and to encourage listeners, especially unaffiliated non-scientists to make the effort to find a local IRB and volunteer to become a board member. As a non scientific member your concerns will probably be carefully considered, especially since your attendance will be extra valuable in ensuring a quorum.

[Psax]

I agree that the invasion of quackery into academic medicine is a major problem.

Yes, everywhere.
Here is some links to short articles about establishing of Traditional Chinese medicine centre right at the Hradec Králové University Hospital! (Czech Republic).
This TCM center was inaugurated by the Chinese president Xi Jinping in 2016.
Let's give up on science, human rights, president Havel's legacy and let's make some business with China... OMG, bad politics and money seems to be superior to everything...

http://praguemonitor.com/2015/06/18/czech-chinese-traditional-medicine-centre-opens-hradec-kralove
http://www.radio.cz/en/section/news/centre-of-traditional-chinese-medicine-to-be-built-in-the-czech-republic

[Fast Eddie B]

My wife had occasion to be prescribed physical therapy recently.

Her treatment was quite conventional. But in the office was a flyer for “Dry Needling”:





They claim it’s not any form of acupuncture.  We had not heard of it, and wonder if it’s evidence-based.

[werecow]

I too would appreciate the SGU's take on dry needling. In the meantime, here's what I've learned so far:

Both my mother and a friend of mine have recently had dry needling done in their hip by their physical therapists, and while they both reported that their symptoms have improved since the treatment, they did report being very sore from the treatment for a number of days. This is definitely a therapy that sets off red flags in my head. I read a little bit about it at the time and advised them caution, but I didn't reach any really solid conclusions. It seemed dubious to me, though. From what I've read, the evidence for efficacy is ambiguous (with better designed studies showing less effectiveness - not a good sign). The wikipedia article for dry needling also has a section on efficacy which says roughly the same thing. Even though PTs deny that they are the same thing, the idea of trigger points sure sounds a whole lot like meridians and acupuncture points - which is no surprise, as several articles I read claimed that that is where the idea originated. If that is true, the fact that it has its origins in part in acupuncture makes me very suspicious. It's an increasingly common treatment among PTs nowadays, and the idea that doing something to a muscle might alleviate pain does not seem that implausible, but the question is whether it works better than less invasive methods. Even though PTs might have better hygiene standards than some acupuncturists, they are still sticking needles through the skin and into the muscle. The Guardian also has a decent article on it.

[Mr. Beagle]

A word for Cara (if it hasn't been used already): homunculus, in the sense of the perception of a "little person" living in our head. The VR discussion is a great example of the homunculus illusion at work.

[Phobosanddeimos]

First time post - and thankyou SGU. I've been listening since about 2007 and since getting PTSD in 2009 the SGU has definitely helped save my life.

Ermmm... but... following your 'Psych' chat on episode #654 could Cara Santa Maria please do a segment explaining
*exactly* how (made-up pseudoscience quackery. So dumb it makes homeopathy look semi-rational) EMDR  'works' ?

Then maybe explain how 'Victim Blaming' CBT ("It's all your fault") is supposed to 'help' with PTSD or say with depression/anxiety from abuse victims.

Does Cara Santa Maria's college conduct harm inflicting non-consensual medical experiments? Or is that only done by the Quackademics I saw here in the UK?
https://www.un.org/development/desa/disabilities/convention-on-the-rights-of-persons-with-disabilities/article-15-freedom-from-torture-or-cruel-inhuman-or-degrading-treatment-or-punishment.html

Cara Santa Maria is doing a Phd? Will that allow her to describe herself as "Doctor" to any patients?
Here in the UK that would be criminal offences -
Medical Act 1983 -
Penalty for pretending to be registered -
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1983/54/section/49
Penalty for pretending to hold a licence to practise -
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1983/54/section/49A
Misconduct in Public Office -
http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/l_to_o/misconduct_in_public_office/

But that doesn't stop Quackademics from swanning around the NHS calling themselves "Doctor".
https://www.cardiff.ac.uk/people/search?collection=profiles&gscope1=1&form=search-en&query=psychology

Richard Wiseman said on episode #654 that they call a Psychologist first... Well, fakes are cheaper than the real thing (IMO).

-

It would be nice if SGU did a "Pseudoscience That Kills" segment on the UK governments "Work Capability Assessment".
https://www.google.co.uk/search?ei=XXdlWtSGNuKegAa49KuIAw&q=wca+deaths&oq=wca+deaths

I have just (and only *just*) managed to survive the NINTH one of those in the past eight years.
A United Nations inquiry described it and the rest of their maltreatment as "grave and systematic violations" of disabled people's rights and a 'human catastrophe'.
https://www.google.co.uk/search?ei=uXtlWvfxBYm9gAbu7oGwDw&q=UN+grave+and+systematic&oq=UN+grave+and+systematic

UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities – Articles
https://www.un.org/development/desa/disabilities/convention-on-the-rights-of-persons-with-disabilities/convention-on-the-rights-of-persons-with-disabilities-2.html

UN Convention against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment
http://www.ohchr.org/EN/ProfessionalInterest/Pages/CAT.aspx

All based on quackademic pseudoscience - like BS 'models of disability'.

Anyway thankyou again for the 99% brilliant show 
-

[Jeremy's Sea]

If you hold a PhD you are a Dr. That doesn't always mean MD though. My friend is a doctor of film studies, but your mileage may vary.
Have you perchance heard of Scientology?

[ToddZ]

California bears injured in wildfire treated for burns with tilapia fish skin bandages and miscellaneous pseudoscience:

"The tilapia wraps, which were made from live fish purchased at a nearby market, last for about 10 days before turning leathery and losing the collagen necessary to help repair skin. Along with the fish bandages, the bears also received acupuncture, chiropractic treatment, and cold laser therapy to help with pain and healing."
 - https://earther.com/these-tilapia-bandaged-bears-burned-in-california-fires-1822446162

Would love to hear your thoughts on this.

[Fast Eddie B]

California bears injured in wildfire treated for burns with tilapia fish skin bandages and miscellaneous pseudoscience:

"The tilapia wraps, which were made from live fish purchased at a nearby market, last for about 10 days before turning leathery and losing the collagen necessary to help repair skin. Along with the fish bandages, the bears also received acupuncture, chiropractic treatment, and cold laser therapy to help with pain and healing."
 - https://earther.com/these-tilapia-bandaged-bears-burned-in-california-fires-1822446162

Would love to hear your thoughts on this.

I saw that report on the CBS Evening News, and wondered about it.

[Phobosanddeimos]

If you hold a PhD you are a Dr. That doesn't always mean MD though. My friend is a doctor of film studies, but your mileage may vary.
Have you perchance heard of Scientology?

>"My friend is a doctor of film studies"
And if your friend used his PhD to con Ill/Injured PATIENTS into thinking that his quack treatments were something to do with Medicine from a "Doctor" then he would rightly get stuffed in prison.
How come quacks with Zero Medical Qualifications (Clinical Psychologists) are allowed to get away with it?

Do you know what EMDR actually is?
A fraudster gives you the finger, and your eye movement is supposed to somehow (by the power of greyskull?) magically move memories from 'bad' bits of your brain to 'good' bits of your brain. And that's it.
And for PTSD they throw in a bit of 'Trauma Focusing' to give a False Positive in their fraud based studies.

I don't have some BS PhD... so if I flick someone off am I causing them brain damage?
At least with homeopathy you get a drink of water along with the - nothing else.

>"Have you perchance heard of Scientology?"
Cheeky bleep
Have you perchance heard of -
DOCTOR Steven Novella? - https://theness.com/neurologicablog/index.php/the-layer-of-unnecessary-ritual/
The New England Skeptical Society? - https://theness.com/index.php/emdr-and-fad-therapies/
Robert Todd Carroll? - http://skepdic.com/emdr.html
Edzard Ernst? - If I can find the link...

Have you perchance not heard of The United Nations?
http://www.ohchr.org/EN/HRBodies/CRPD/Pages/InquiryProcedure.aspx
http://www.ohchr.org/Documents/HRBodies/CRPD/CRPD.C.15.R.2.Rev.1-ENG.doc
"Consequently, the Committee considers that there is reliable evidence that the threshold of grave or systematic violations of the rights of persons with disabilities has been met in the State party."

Or perchance, just some lone nut with a camera (me ) -

.... and after 4.5 months of their quack based pseudoscience Starvation Torture -
http://phobosanddeimos.net/wp/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/PMcriminalTheresaMay-07.jpg

[Jeremy's Sea]

Ironically those that need a psychologists help the most often decray them as frauds.

[arthwollipot]

Ironically those that need a psychologists help the most often decray them as frauds.

Them and Scientologists.

[Phobosanddeimos]

Ironically those that need a psychologists help the most often decray them as frauds.

Them and Scientologists.

What a couple of vile lowlife hate trolls.

Do either of you understand what a LINK is?

So myself, Steven Novella, The New England Skeptical Society, Robert Todd Carroll, Edzard Ernst and The United Nations are all "Scientologists" are we?

I do not "decray them as frauds" (it's spelt 'decry'). I show them as frauds with the EVIDENCE you ignore.

>"Ironically those that need a psychologists help the most often decray them as frauds."
Wrong. It's those with EXPERIENCE of their abusing quackery that often decry them as frauds.
.

[Jeremy's Sea]

Ironically those that need a psychologists help the most often decray them as frauds.

Them and Scientologists.

What a couple of vile lowlife hate trolls.

Do either of you understand what a LINK is?

So myself, Steven Novella, The New England Skeptical Society, Robert Todd Carroll, Edzard Ernst and The United Nations are all "Scientologists" are we?

I do not "decray them as frauds" (it's spelt 'decry'). I show them as frauds with the EVIDENCE you ignore.

>"Ironically those that need a psychologists help the most often decray them as frauds."
Wrong. It's those with EXPERIENCE of their abusing quackery that often decry them as frauds.
.

I didn't add an apostrophe to "psychologist's" either - you done slipped up on winning internet points. I don't know anything about EMDR, but coming in and "decrying" an entire discipline of medicine as being quacks will get you the "hate troll" treatment as it comes off as hate troll crankery TL;DR, which this forum is littered with. Welcome!

[Phobosanddeimos]

I didn't add an apostrophe to "psychologist's" either - you done slipped up on winning internet points. I don't know anything about EMDR, but coming in and "decrying" an entire discipline of medicine as being quacks will get you the "hate troll" treatment as it comes off as hate troll crankery TL;DR, which this forum is littered with. Welcome!

>"you done slipped up on winning internet points"

I done do I?  :p
Spelling wasn't the point of my peNdantry.
You are capable of clicking on a LINK right? And doing so BEFORE going off screaming "Scientologist Alert...Scientologist Alert".

>"I don't know anything about EMDR"
Well no s**t... You are capable of clicking on a LINK right?

>"decrying" an entire discipline of medicine"
'Clinical' Psychology is NOT medicine. Clinical Psychologists have ZERO medical qualifications, they're NOT medical 'Doctors' (I guess with a few rare exceptions).
And try 'looking behind the curtain' of their EMDR and CBT BS  (You are capable of clicking on a LINK right?)

>"as it comes off as hate troll crankery"
It would do to supporters of their abject quackery. (You are capable of clicking on a LINK right?)
.