Author Topic: LCHF and healthy eating  (Read 138610 times)

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Online CarbShark

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LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #1575 on: May 18, 2019, 06:50:26 PM »

McDonald's French Fry Ingredients: Potatoes, Vegetable Oil (Canola Oil, Corn Oil, Soybean Oil, Hydrogenated Soybean Oil, Natural Beef Flavor [Wheat and Milk Derivatives]*), Dextrose, Sodium Acid Pyrophosphate (Maintain Color), Salt.

Perfectly good potatoes poisoned by vegetable oil.

They used to fry them in lard, but someone gave them the idea that was unhealthy.

Go figure.

(Hint, for several reasons high quality lard is healthier than the vegetable oils they're using, and made better fries)
« Last Edit: May 26, 2019, 05:09:27 PM by CarbShark »
and Donald Trump is President of the United States.

I'm not a doctor, I'm just someone who has done a ton of research into diet and nutrition.

Online CarbShark

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LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #1576 on: May 18, 2019, 06:54:52 PM »
And actually, any mass-produced reconstituted meat pruduct, such as McDonald's burger patties, is in fact ultraprocessed according to the study.

https://world.openfoodfacts.org/nova
The hotdog would, the beef patty would not, by that definition.
The article literally uses a picture of a burger to illustrate the ultraprocessed diet...

Yea, I'll let you know when I read the study.

FWIW, if they call a McDonalds hamburger 100% ultra-processed that would bother me.
Whether or not McDonald's burgers count, I strongly doubt the macronutrient quantities vary hugely from one brand of burger to another.

Should be easy enough to check. Funny you'd make a statement about the macronutrients in foods, without taking a few seconds to look up the actual facts, and then in your next post criticize me for commenting on a study after I've read coverage of the study in multiple science based websites, read its abstract and read tweets from the author.

I'll read the entire study tonight when I can get past the paywall.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2019, 05:10:40 PM by CarbShark »
and Donald Trump is President of the United States.

I'm not a doctor, I'm just someone who has done a ton of research into diet and nutrition.

Online gmalivuk

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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #1577 on: May 18, 2019, 07:33:44 PM »
You're right, it's not hard to check, and all the burgers I glanced at information for are fairly similar. If you think McDonald's is a significant outlier, the burden of proof is on you.
The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better...is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides.

Offline lonely moa

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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #1578 on: May 18, 2019, 08:27:18 PM »

McDonald's French Fry Ingredients: Potatoes, Vegetable Oil (Canola Oil, Corn Oil, Soybean Oil, Hydrogenated Soybean Oil, Natural Beef Flavor [Wheat and Milk Derivatives]*), Dextrose, Sodium Acid Pyrophosphate (Maintain Color), Salt.

Perfectly good potatoes poisoned by vegetable oil.

They used to fry them in lard, but someone gave them the idea that was unhealthy.

Go figure.

(Hint, for several reasons high quality yard is healthier than the vegetable oils they're using, and made better fries)

Yeah,no, canola, soy, corn are all cheaper than lard. 
"Pull the goalie", Malcolm Gladwell.

Online CarbShark

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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #1579 on: May 18, 2019, 09:23:19 PM »
You're right, it's not hard to check, and all the burgers I glanced at information for are fairly similar. If you think McDonald's is a significant outlier, the burden of proof is on you.
I didn’t make that claim.




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and Donald Trump is President of the United States.

I'm not a doctor, I'm just someone who has done a ton of research into diet and nutrition.

Online CarbShark

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LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #1580 on: May 26, 2019, 04:55:49 PM »
In other news Facebook is banning LCHF advocacy groups, one with over a million members.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2019, 05:07:12 PM by CarbShark »
and Donald Trump is President of the United States.

I'm not a doctor, I'm just someone who has done a ton of research into diet and nutrition.

Online CarbShark

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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #1581 on: May 26, 2019, 04:58:56 PM »

https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fendo.2019.00348/abstract


Quote
Purpose: Studies on long-term sustainability of low-carbohydrate approaches to treat diabetes are limited. We previously reported the effectiveness of a novel digitally-monitored continuous care intervention (CCI) including nutritional ketosis in improving weight, glycemic outcomes, lipid, and liver marker changes at 1 year. Here, we assess the effects of the CCI at 2 years.
Materials and methods: An open label, non-randomized, controlled study with
262 and 87 participants with T2D were enrolled in the CCI and usual care (UC) groups, respectively. Primary outcomes were retention, glycemic control, and weight changes at 2 years. Secondary outcomes included changes in body composition, liver, cardiovascular, kidney, thyroid and inflammatory markers; diabetes medication use and disease status.
Results: Significant changes from baseline to 2 years in the CCI group included: HbA1c (-12% from 7.7±0.1%); fasting glucose (-18% from 163.7±3.9 mg/dL); fasting insulin (-42% from 27.7±1.3 mIU L-1); weight (-10% from 114.56±0.60 kg); systolic blood pressure (-4% from 131.7±0.9 mmHg); diastolic blood pressure (-4% from 81.8±0.5 mmHg); triglycerides (-22% from 197.2±9.1 mg/dL); HDL-C (+19% from 41.8±0.9 mg/dL), and liver alanine transaminase (-21% from 29.16±0.97 U/L). Spine bone mineral density in the CCI group was unchanged. Glycemic control medication use (excluding metformin) among CCI participants declined (from 55.7% to 26.8%, P=1.3x10-11) including prescribed insulin (-62%) and sulfonylureas (-100%). The UC group had no significant changes in these parameters (except uric acid and anion gap) or diabetes medication use. There was also significant resolution of diabetes (reversal, 53.5%; remission, 17.6%) in the CCI group but not in UC. All the reported improvements had p-values <0.00012.
Conclusion: The CCI group sustained long-term beneficial effects on multiple clinical markers of diabetes and cardiometabolic health at 2 years while utilizing less medication. The intervention was also effective in the resolution of diabetes and visceral obesity with no adverse effect on bone health.





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and Donald Trump is President of the United States.

I'm not a doctor, I'm just someone who has done a ton of research into diet and nutrition.

Online CarbShark

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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #1582 on: May 26, 2019, 05:06:46 PM »
And actually, any mass-produced reconstituted meat pruduct, such as McDonald's burger patties, is in fact ultraprocessed according to the study.

https://world.openfoodfacts.org/nova
The hotdog would, the beef patty would not, by that definition.
The article literally uses a picture of a burger to illustrate the ultraprocessed diet...

Yea, I'll let you know when I read the study.

FWIW, if they call a McDonalds hamburger 100% ultra-processed that would bother me.
Whether or not McDonald's burgers count, I strongly doubt the macronutrient quantities vary hugely from one brand of burger to another.

Should be easy enough to check. Funny you'd make a statement about the macronutrients in foods, without taking a few seconds to look up the actual facts, and then in your next post criticize mein your first post criticizing me for commenting on a study after I've read coverage of the study in multiple science based websites, read its abstract and read tweets from the author.

I'll read the entire study tonight when I can get past the paywall.
It’s hard to say if they consider ground beef ultra processed. They were providing meals where the preponderance of calories came from ultra processed foods, and the one burger in the twenty something meals they provided was surrounded by processed food.

As to the rest of the foods I do have a couple quibbles. Yoghurt is should be considered ultra processed. Same with nearly any bread.

Looking at the photos side by side it’s easy to see why the processed group ate more. On one side they have bread, pastries, pastas and sweets. On the other a plate full of broccoli. 


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and Donald Trump is President of the United States.

I'm not a doctor, I'm just someone who has done a ton of research into diet and nutrition.

Online CarbShark

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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #1583 on: May 26, 2019, 05:15:45 PM »
Here's a link to the Kevin Hall study and the supplemental information:

https://ars.els-cdn.com/content/image/1-s2.0-S1550413119302487-mmc2.pdf
and Donald Trump is President of the United States.

I'm not a doctor, I'm just someone who has done a ton of research into diet and nutrition.

Online CarbShark

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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #1584 on: May 26, 2019, 10:30:42 PM »

McDonald's French Fry Ingredients: Potatoes, Vegetable Oil (Canola Oil, Corn Oil, Soybean Oil, Hydrogenated Soybean Oil, Natural Beef Flavor [Wheat and Milk Derivatives]*), Dextrose, Sodium Acid Pyrophosphate (Maintain Color), Salt.

Perfectly good potatoes poisoned by vegetable oil.

They used to fry them in lard, but someone gave them the idea that was unhealthy.

Go figure.

(Hint, for several reasons high quality yard is healthier than the vegetable oils they're using, and made better fries)

Yeah,no, canola, soy, corn are all cheaper than lard.

You might think so, but it turns out that if you churing out billions of hamburgers, where most of the fat (tallow/lard) is discarded, it becomes more economical to repurpose the fat.

Which is what they did until irrational lippophobia reached pandemic proportions.
and Donald Trump is President of the United States.

I'm not a doctor, I'm just someone who has done a ton of research into diet and nutrition.

Offline bachfiend

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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #1585 on: May 27, 2019, 01:30:00 AM »
And actually, any mass-produced reconstituted meat pruduct, such as McDonald's burger patties, is in fact ultraprocessed according to the study.

https://world.openfoodfacts.org/nova
The hotdog would, the beef patty would not, by that definition.
The article literally uses a picture of a burger to illustrate the ultraprocessed diet...

Yea, I'll let you know when I read the study.

FWIW, if they call a McDonalds hamburger 100% ultra-processed that would bother me.
Whether or not McDonald's burgers count, I strongly doubt the macronutrient quantities vary hugely from one brand of burger to another.

Should be easy enough to check. Funny you'd make a statement about the macronutrients in foods, without taking a few seconds to look up the actual facts, and then in your next post criticize mein your first post criticizing me for commenting on a study after I've read coverage of the study in multiple science based websites, read its abstract and read tweets from the author.

I'll read the entire study tonight when I can get past the paywall.
It’s hard to say if they consider ground beef ultra processed. They were providing meals where the preponderance of calories came from ultra processed foods, and the one burger in the twenty something meals they provided was surrounded by processed food.

As to the rest of the foods I do have a couple quibbles. Yoghurt is should be considered ultra processed. Same with nearly any bread.

Looking at the photos side by side it’s easy to see why the processed group ate more. On one side they have bread, pastries, pastas and sweets. On the other a plate full of broccoli. 


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Why should yoghurt and most breads be considered ultra-processed?  Besides your ideological commitment to your high fat/low carbohydrate ketogenic diet.  Yoghurt and bread are amongst the simplest of foods, with a thousands years’ history of providing essential nutrition in aggregate to billions of humans.
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Online CarbShark

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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #1586 on: May 27, 2019, 01:38:51 AM »
They both meet the objective criteria for highly processed food.


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Offline bachfiend

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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #1587 on: May 27, 2019, 07:46:58 AM »
They both meet the objective criteria for highly processed food.


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So what are your ‘objective criteria’ for highly processed food?  Besides your ideological obsession with high fat/low carbohydrate ketogenic diets?

Bread and yoghurt are processed foods.  But they’re not ‘highly processed.’  https://www.heartandstroke.ca/articles/what-is-ultra-processed-food

Highly processed foods should be avoided.  Processed foods are healthy, in moderation.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2019, 07:53:07 AM by bachfiend »
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Online gmalivuk

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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #1588 on: May 27, 2019, 08:27:23 AM »
Yeah,no, canola, soy, corn are all cheaper than lard.

You might think so, but it turns out that if you churing out billions of hamburgers, where most of the fat (tallow/lard) is discarded, it becomes more economical to repurpose the fat.
If that's true should be easy enough to prove by looking at bulk prices rather than your idle speculation. Do you think beef fat just goes in the garbage if people don't want it on their fries?
The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better...is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides.

Offline bachfiend

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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #1589 on: May 27, 2019, 08:51:31 AM »
Yeah,no, canola, soy, corn are all cheaper than lard.

You might think so, but it turns out that if you churing out billions of hamburgers, where most of the fat (tallow/lard) is discarded, it becomes more economical to repurpose the fat.
If that's true should be easy enough to prove by looking at bulk prices rather than your idle speculation. Do you think beef fat just goes in the garbage if people don't want it on their fries?

Well, probably some of it is discarded:

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-46620603

But of course, beef fat has some monetary value.  It can be used to make biofuels for example, with the appropriate infrastructure.
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