Author Topic: LCHF and healthy eating  (Read 163378 times)

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Online jt512

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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #2250 on: January 17, 2020, 08:26:38 pm »

The Nutrition Coalition has very serious conflicts of interests that they don’t mention.

As with any reputable organization, when any member(s) of the group publish articles in peer reviewed journals, they list any potential conflicts of interest.

To say an advocacy group itself has a conflict of interest is absurd.

Except the Nutrition Coalition isn’t a reputable organisation.

You don't know what you're talking about. Again.

Did you read the link I provided?

The Nutrition Coalition is heavy with the likes of Nina Teicholz, who is a very partisan advocate for the beef industry:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nina_Teicholz

Heavy with the likes? Teicholz is on the board. News flash, being an advocate for nutrition is not a conflict of interest. I don't see any evidence she works for the beef industry.

But even is she is, that doesn't make the Nutrition Coalition not reputable.

It does in my eyes.  I put it in the same category as global heating denial organisations.  If I want information on nutrition, I won’t at look at them.  I want more reputable sources.

Here's what journalists should opine about nutrition: nothing.

Here's what journalists should opine about nutrition, science, religion, politics and any thing else they want to opine about: Anything they want to.

Journalists have a responsibility to tell the truth. That implies just shutting up when they don’t have they’re not qualified to distinguish fact from fiction.

Journalists writing opinion pieces are expressing opinions. Journalists writing news articles and essays are presenting facts.

Also, simply writing things that you don't agree with does not mean they’re not qualified to distinguish fact from fiction.


The author has zero background in any science, much less nutrition, much less nutritional epidemiology.  She had no idea what she was talking about.  Her "opinion piece" was irresponsible, riddled with factual errors, and has been thoroughly rebutted.
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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #2251 on: January 17, 2020, 09:28:51 pm »
The author has zero background in any science, much less nutrition, much less nutritional epidemiology.  She had no idea what she was talking about.  Her "opinion piece" was irresponsible, riddled with factual errors, and has been thoroughly rebutted.

As I recall there were three rather minor facts that were disputed. Two corrections were made. The journal decided not retract the article, despite pressure. And the rebuttals themselves were riddled with fallacious arguments (mostly argument from authority and ad hominem).

If you have a link to an actual rebuttal that you're referring to I'd like to read it.
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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #2252 on: January 18, 2020, 12:57:30 am »
The author has zero background in any science, much less nutrition, much less nutritional epidemiology.  She had no idea what she was talking about.  Her "opinion piece" was irresponsible, riddled with factual errors, and has been thoroughly rebutted.

As I recall there were three rather minor facts that were disputed. Two corrections were made. The journal decided not retract the article, despite pressure. And the rebuttals themselves were riddled with fallacious arguments (mostly argument from authority and ad hominem).

If you have a link to an actual rebuttal that you're referring to I'd like to read it.


https://www.bmj.com/content/351/bmj.h4962/rr-1
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LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #2253 on: January 20, 2020, 12:31:34 pm »
https://www.guidelinecentral.com/share/pocketcard/5dadda48dd342/#i2543ef12

 
Guidelines for doctors treating patients with LCHF diets.

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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #2254 on: January 20, 2020, 01:34:42 pm »
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5040825/


Food consumption and the actual statistics of cardiovascular diseases: an epidemiological comparison of 42 European countries

Our results do not support the association between CVDs and saturated fat, which is still contained in official dietary guidelines. Instead, they agree with data accumulated from recent studies that link CVD risk with the high glycaemic index/load of carbohydrate-based diets. In the absence of any scientific evidence connecting saturated fat with CVDs, these findings show that current dietary recommendations regarding CVDs should be seriously reconsidered.


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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #2255 on: January 20, 2020, 03:16:50 pm »
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5040825/


Food consumption and the actual statistics of cardiovascular diseases: an epidemiological comparison of 42 European countries

Our results do not support the association between CVDs and saturated fat, which is still contained in official dietary guidelines. Instead, they agree with data accumulated from recent studies that link CVD risk with the high glycaemic index/load of carbohydrate-based diets. In the absence of any scientific evidence connecting saturated fat with CVDs, these findings show that current dietary recommendations regarding CVDs should be seriously reconsidered.


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It relies on the ecological fallacy, nation wide statistics on entire populations (even if broken down into male or female) and nation wide statistics on total consumption of macronutrients and specific food groups. 
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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #2256 on: January 20, 2020, 03:44:39 pm »
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5040825/


Food consumption and the actual statistics of cardiovascular diseases: an epidemiological comparison of 42 European countries

Our results do not support the association between CVDs and saturated fat, which is still contained in official dietary guidelines. Instead, they agree with data accumulated from recent studies that link CVD risk with the high glycaemic index/load of carbohydrate-based diets. In the absence of any scientific evidence connecting saturated fat with CVDs, these findings show that current dietary recommendations regarding CVDs should be seriously reconsidered.


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Conveniently, the authors inform us in the very first sentence that their study is fallacious: "The aim of this ecological study..."
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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #2258 on: January 21, 2020, 04:13:01 am »
https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2759201?guestAccessKey=bbf63fac-b672-4b03-8a23-dfb52fb97ebc&utm_source=silverchair&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=article_alert-jama&utm_content=olf&utm_term=011520

You’ll never guess who’s quoted here!




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Steven Novella?

He’s not always right.  I stopped listening to the SGU soon after he stuffed up in S or F with the bogus claim that Winston Churchill had bipolar disorder.
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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #2259 on: January 23, 2020, 10:30:18 am »
Not sure if this was posted here or not...

Red and Processed Meat Guideline Recommendations | Annals of Internal Medicine | American College of Physicians

Quote
The panel suggests that adults continue current unprocessed red meat consumption (weak recommendation, low-certainty evidence). Similarly, the panel suggests adults continue current processed meat consumption (weak recommendation, low-certainty evidence).
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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #2260 on: January 23, 2020, 10:36:18 am »
OK, this is crap. It's the same kind of epidemiological study, based on MB-FFQ.

Further, the lowest consumption of carbs observed is 37%, which is barely carb restricted.

But it does counter the "u-shaped curve" claims made from similar studies.

I am not using it to support any LCHF diet claims.

Association of Low-Carbohydrate and Low-Fat Diets With Mortality Among US Adults | Lifestyle Behaviors | JAMA Internal Medicine | JAMA Network

Quote
In this cohort study of 37 233 US adults 20 years or older, overall low-carbohydrate and low-fat diets were not associated with total mortality, but a healthy low-carbohydrate diet (lower amounts of low-quality carbohydrates and higher amounts of plant protein and unsaturated fat) and a healthy low-fat diet (lower amounts of saturated fat and higher amounts of high-quality carbohydrates and plant protein) were associated with lower total mortality.
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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #2261 on: January 23, 2020, 12:58:30 pm »
Not sure if this was posted here or not...

Red and Processed Meat Guideline Recommendations | Annals of Internal Medicine | American College of Physicians

Quote
The panel suggests that adults continue current unprocessed red meat consumption (weak recommendation, low-certainty evidence). Similarly, the panel suggests adults continue current processed meat consumption (weak recommendation, low-certainty evidence).


Yes, those recommendations, which are not supported by the data, and in fact do not even logically follow from it, was posted here, probably by you.
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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #2262 on: January 23, 2020, 01:01:31 pm »
OK, this is crap. It's the same kind of epidemiological study, based on MB-FFQ.

Further, the lowest consumption of carbs observed is 37%, which is barely carb restricted.

But it does counter the "u-shaped curve" claims made from similar studies.

I am not using it to support any LCHF diet claims.

Association of Low-Carbohydrate and Low-Fat Diets With Mortality Among US Adults | Lifestyle Behaviors | JAMA Internal Medicine | JAMA Network

Quote
In this cohort study of 37 233 US adults 20 years or older, overall low-carbohydrate and low-fat diets were not associated with total mortality, but a healthy low-carbohydrate diet (lower amounts of low-quality carbohydrates and higher amounts of plant protein and unsaturated fat) and a healthy low-fat diet (lower amounts of saturated fat and higher amounts of high-quality carbohydrates and plant protein) were associated with lower total mortality.


Dietary assessment was not by FFQ (there's actually no such thing as an MB-FFQ), and the study doesn't really counter anything.  What the results say, as usual, is regardless of the macronutrient content of your diet, the more plant-based your diet is, the better off you are.
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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #2263 on: January 23, 2020, 01:24:08 pm »
Not sure if this was posted here or not...

Red and Processed Meat Guideline Recommendations | Annals of Internal Medicine | American College of Physicians

Quote
The panel suggests that adults continue current unprocessed red meat consumption (weak recommendation, low-certainty evidence). Similarly, the panel suggests adults continue current processed meat consumption (weak recommendation, low-certainty evidence).


Yes, those recommendations, which are not supported by the data, and in fact do not even logically follow from it, was posted here, probably by you.

Could be (I post other places, but couldn't find it here.)

What they are saying is that since there is no good evidence to support the recommendation to reduce or increase, the guideline should be to not change.

That logically follows from the lack of good evidence.
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Re: LCHF and healthy eating
« Reply #2264 on: January 23, 2020, 01:26:52 pm »
OK, this is crap. It's the same kind of epidemiological study, based on MB-FFQ.

Further, the lowest consumption of carbs observed is 37%, which is barely carb restricted.

But it does counter the "u-shaped curve" claims made from similar studies.

I am not using it to support any LCHF diet claims.

Association of Low-Carbohydrate and Low-Fat Diets With Mortality Among US Adults | Lifestyle Behaviors | JAMA Internal Medicine | JAMA Network

Quote
In this cohort study of 37 233 US adults 20 years or older, overall low-carbohydrate and low-fat diets were not associated with total mortality, but a healthy low-carbohydrate diet (lower amounts of low-quality carbohydrates and higher amounts of plant protein and unsaturated fat) and a healthy low-fat diet (lower amounts of saturated fat and higher amounts of high-quality carbohydrates and plant protein) were associated with lower total mortality.


Dietary assessment was not by FFQ (there's actually no such thing as an MB-FFQ), ...

You may not like the term "Memory Based -Food Frequency Questionnaire" but it is a thing, it does appear in the peer reviewed literature and it is a good and accurate description of the tool used to gather dietary information for these epidemiological studies.

Quote
... and the study doesn't really counter anything.  What the results say, as usual, is regardless of the macronutrient content of your diet, the more plant-based your diet is, the better off you are.

OK.
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