Author Topic: Religion.jpg  (Read 40985 times)

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Online 2397

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Re: Religion.jpg
« Reply #375 on: April 24, 2019, 12:53:39 AM »
The original baptism was of an adult.

Offline arthwollipot

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Re: Religion.jpg
« Reply #376 on: April 24, 2019, 12:58:33 AM »
The original baptism was of an adult.

Exactly, and that was how it was done in my church. An adult gets to choose to undergo baptism. Infant baptism is not done by the choice of the infant.
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Re: Religion.jpg
« Reply #377 on: April 24, 2019, 05:36:48 AM »
Just dramaturgy.
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Re: Religion.jpg
« Reply #378 on: April 24, 2019, 06:58:11 AM »
Yeah, I was baptized as an adult (well, I was like 16 or 17, but whatever).  We had ceremonies for infants, but I can't remember what we called the ceremony.  There was an anointing with oil on the forehead and prayer.  It was basically for the parents to pray that their child will grow up healthy and come to know god in their time.


Full immersion baptism is supposed to represent a death/rebirth of a new person who has accepted Jesus.  I never understood how the sprinkling represented the same thing.  I never really understood baptism of infants, they haven't accepted table food yet, much less a savior.
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Re: Religion.jpg
« Reply #379 on: April 24, 2019, 10:29:30 AM »
Accepting Christ is not the point of Catholic baptism. It’s being welcomed into the kingdom of god.

The Catholic equivalent of adult baptism would be catechism and confirmation.


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Offline John Albert

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Re: Religion.jpg
« Reply #380 on: April 24, 2019, 01:56:10 PM »
Confirmation usually happens in the third grade, about age 8.

That's the age at which a person becomes an adult in the "eyes of the Church."

Offline Desert Fox

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Re: Religion.jpg
« Reply #381 on: April 24, 2019, 02:19:40 PM »
You do want to get them when they are young
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Re: Religion.jpg
« Reply #382 on: April 24, 2019, 02:30:36 PM »
Before that independent thinking begins to kick in.

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Re: Religion.jpg
« Reply #383 on: April 24, 2019, 02:41:53 PM »
I'd like to get rid of the concept that children are a part of religion at all, until they're legal adults who can choose. Let parents bring them with them, as they bring them places in general. But religious organizations shouldn't have the personal details of any children, or have any programs aimed at them. If they provide childcare, it should be required to follow the same standards that any childcare outside of a religion has to.

And if they provide medical services, nationalize them, secularize them, and be done with it. Let the doctors treat their patients based on best practice, not based on whether management thinks that something is a sin.

Pretty much the last time* I went to church was my confirmation. I had to go to church a number of times, read these verses, etc., and my reward for completing the process was not having to do it anymore. No one offered me the choice between church confirmation or humanist confirmation ahead of time, let alone any other alternatives. No one really talked to me about my faith.

*About once a year after that, until I gave up on everything but funerals, after I had been to two baptisms for infant family members in a few months, and got fed up listening to what the adults were saying on behalf of them.

Offline seamas

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Re: Religion.jpg
« Reply #384 on: April 25, 2019, 01:19:30 PM »
Confirmation usually happens in the third grade, about age 8.

That's the age at which a person becomes an adult in the "eyes of the Church."

The Catholic Church has been all over the place on it, but in the USA the church has put confirmation a bit older than in other places.
It has been roughly age 13 for a long time, and is the last sacrement learned and undertaken in the catechism.

When I was going through Catholic education (I'm 52 now), First Holy communion was in 2nd grade, (about age 7). We did our first penance in 4th grade, and Confirmation in seventh or eighth grade.

I understand in recent times they put penance earlier than communion.

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Re: Religion.jpg
« Reply #385 on: April 25, 2019, 03:05:57 PM »
Confirmation usually happens in the third grade, about age 8.

That's the age at which a person becomes an adult in the "eyes of the Church."

The Catholic Church has been all over the place on it, but in the USA the church has put confirmation a bit older than in other places.
It has been roughly age 13 for a long time, and is the last sacrement learned and undertaken in the catechism.

When I was going through Catholic education (I'm 52 now), First Holy communion was in 2nd grade, (about age 7). We did our first penance in 4th grade, and Confirmation in seventh or eighth grade.

I understand in recent times they put penance earlier than communion.

I was also raised Catholic and attended a Catholic school until 8th grade.  I recall going through the various sacraments in the same order and times as seamas described.
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Offline arthwollipot

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Re: Religion.jpg
« Reply #386 on: April 25, 2019, 11:25:31 PM »
Full immersion baptism is supposed to represent a death/rebirth of a new person who has accepted Jesus.  I never understood how the sprinkling represented the same thing.  I never really understood baptism of infants, they haven't accepted table food yet, much less a savior.

It's also about being "washed clean" of one's sins, and is tied to very ancient concepts of running water representing purity.
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Re: Religion.jpg
« Reply #387 on: April 26, 2019, 12:01:58 AM »
Full immersion baptism is supposed to represent a death/rebirth of a new person who has accepted Jesus.  I never understood how the sprinkling represented the same thing.  I never really understood baptism of infants, they haven't accepted table food yet, much less a savior.

It's also about being "washed clean" of one's sins, and is tied to very ancient concepts of running water representing purity.

On the one hand, I find it fascinating that modern studies show a relationship between physical cleansing and the feeling of moral cleanliness. On the other hand I hear that and think "Fuel for woo fires. Here we go."
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Offline Desert Fox

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Re: Religion.jpg
« Reply #388 on: April 27, 2019, 03:06:57 PM »
"Give me the storm and tempest of thought and action, rather than the dead calm of ignorance and faith. Banish me from Eden when you will; but first let me eat of the fruit of the tree of knowledge."
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Offline John Albert

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Re: Religion.jpg
« Reply #389 on: April 27, 2019, 05:16:36 PM »
Confirmation usually happens in the third grade, about age 8.

That's the age at which a person becomes an adult in the "eyes of the Church."

The Catholic Church has been all over the place on it, but in the USA the church has put confirmation a bit older than in other places.
It has been roughly age 13 for a long time, and is the last sacrement learned and undertaken in the catechism.

When I was going through Catholic education (I'm 52 now), First Holy communion was in 2nd grade, (about age 7). We did our first penance in 4th grade, and Confirmation in seventh or eighth grade.

I understand in recent times they put penance earlier than communion.

I was also raised Catholic and attended a Catholic school until 8th grade.  I recall going through the various sacraments in the same order and times as seamas described.

It was roughly the same for me. I made my 1st communion in third grade, first confession in fourth grade, and confirmation in sixth grade.

But these days confirmation age appears to be trending much younger than when we were kids.

 

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