Author Topic: Climate Change Catchment Thread  (Read 52952 times)

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Offline gebobs

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Re: Climate Change Catchment Thread
« Reply #915 on: September 23, 2019, 10:39:09 AM »
Direct action is not about making friends. If you make life inconvenient enough for long enough, policies will begin to shift.

It's a pretty poor protest that doesn't piss at least some people off.

Offline CarbShark

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Re: Climate Change Catchment Thread
« Reply #916 on: September 23, 2019, 10:46:27 AM »
Just had our roof replaced. We got the most reflective shingles  on the market and the roofing company installed high tech ventilation that keeps the air circulating in the attic keeping the whole house cooler.

We had temperatures in the 90s yesterday and the air conditioner barely came on. Last week it ran all day and most of the night when it was that hot.

Due to our neighbors’ trees we can’t install solar because we’re in the shade most of the morning.


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Offline moj

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Re: Climate Change Catchment Thread
« Reply #917 on: September 23, 2019, 11:58:23 AM »
In DC today there where a bunch of protest about climate that blocked off busy intersections all over town making traffic worse. I get that they are trying to raise awareness but this seems like the wrong way to go about it. I don't see how making an already bad traffic situation worse is going to grow the number of people actively doing something help the environment? By contrast I thought Jonathan Safran Foer has been really effective on the morning shows talking about his new book "we are the weather". He talks about little things people can do everyday that will collectively push us in the right direct. Like eating less meat, driving and flying less. Its empowering to give real examples of things people can do to help instead of just thinking its to big deal with individuality. Its such a large issue that many tactics will be needed. The shutting down traffic protest seem more like admitting that any attention is good and disagree with that philosophy. Do traffic protest help?

Direct action is not about making friends. If you make life inconvenient enough for long enough, policies will begin to shift.

Small individual acts are important but in the grand scheme of things they are counterproductive, because they allow for corporations and governments to keep working towards the climate apocalypse while pushing the responsibility to the individuals who cannot even hope to budge the numbers. We should not fragment the blame and take on too much responsibility just so that the rich bastards that are murdering the planet for short-term personal gain can lay back and laugh at all the plebs thinking that skipping a salami pizza or a holiday could matter.


I don't see how making traffic a little worse does any of that, has it ever been successful and how would you know?

I disagree, that small acts are counter productive. Like JSF mentions you really need to do both the actions of the individual and the large actions by counties and companies. They feed into each other. By individual taking small personal actions they are more likely to talk to there friends about it. The more people that are talking and doing things about it, the easier it is pass things that hold those in power accountable. I don't think it's one or the other, it's all things effective. You won't get the big fish until people take it more seriously in the own lives.

Offline Rai

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Re: Climate Change Catchment Thread
« Reply #918 on: September 23, 2019, 12:14:55 PM »

I don't see how making traffic a little worse does any of that, has it ever been successful and how would you know?

Tell me a better way of drawing attention to yourself in a big city. Traffic is an amazing tool. Cities are over-congested hellholes and even a short, minor blockade at the right spot can lead to exponentially larger disruptions across a huge area, with drivers trying to find out what is the reason. You also only need a few dozen activists to make as much noise as a regular protest would.

I disagree, that small acts are counter productive. Like JSF mentions you really need to do both the actions of the individual and the large actions by counties and companies. They feed into each other. By individual taking small personal actions they are more likely to talk to there friends about it. The more people that are talking and doing things about it, the easier it is pass things that hold those in power accountable. I don't think it's one or the other, it's all things effective. You won't get the big fish until people take it more seriously in the own lives.
f
We have no time for small acts. We hardly have time for big acts either. It is either bringing out the slicey bois and start destroying the means of production within the next ten minutes or we are toast.

I am not saying we should not take small, personal actions. It's a nice feelgood gesture that can alleviate the mental burden of what the capitalists did to the planet and our dire, hopeless futures. But let's not kid ourselves that it will bring meaningful change or that it will save anyone or anything.
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Offline Soldier of FORTRAN

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Re: Climate Change Catchment Thread
« Reply #919 on: September 23, 2019, 12:23:01 PM »
People had to kill and die for just the 40 hour work week.  How much can we retool the global economy with nice, soft, polite protests?
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Offline moj

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Re: Climate Change Catchment Thread
« Reply #920 on: September 23, 2019, 12:56:36 PM »
I don't think we really disagree all that much, I'm all for getting companies to do more. I just don't understand how you can tell if shutting down traffic is effective for the cause?  Sure people talk about it for a day, then what? Is it supposed to help with recruitment or it just raise awareness? If its just awareness doing thins online seems like it would be a better investment of resources. I could totally be wrong, maybe they do work but no one I've talked to in real life was like, this protest changed my mind about... I didn't know anything about climate then the protest and now I'm all against oil... It seems like a stretch and excuse to for those who want to do protesty things to act them out instead of great benefit to whatever the cause is. Are there any signs after a traffic protest that it worked?

Online John Albert

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Re: Climate Change Catchment Thread
« Reply #921 on: September 23, 2019, 04:26:55 PM »
This is making the rounds on social media.

16 year old activist Greta Thunberg challenges the UN "action summit" on climate change:



Also this:



Ho-lee shiiiiit!
« Last Edit: September 23, 2019, 04:56:37 PM by John Albert »

Offline Soldier of FORTRAN

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... in war the screams are loud and harsh and in peace the wail is so drawn-out we tell ourselves we hear nothing.

Offline CarbShark

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and Donald Trump is President of the United States.

I'm not a doctor, I'm just someone who has done a ton of research into diet and nutrition.

Offline gebobs

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Re: Climate Change Catchment Thread
« Reply #924 on: September 30, 2019, 09:10:12 AM »


Offline Gigabyte

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Re: Climate Change Catchment Thread
« Reply #926 on: September 30, 2019, 03:10:53 PM »
You might think that the false idea that an ostrich buries it's head (they do not) would be allowed to die, and not be used as some mythological metaphor.
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Offline Quetzalcoatl

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Re: Climate Change Catchment Thread
« Reply #927 on: September 30, 2019, 04:56:40 PM »
I read recently that the attack against the Saudi oilfields could have lead to a big drop on the stock market. But it did not. The author of that article partially attributed that to that much of the world is moving away from fossil fuels, and as a result the importance of oil for the global economy is decreasing. The article further stated that nobody talks about "peak oil" anymore, because the demand for oil is steadily decreasing. It further elaborates that the price of oil is lower today than ten years ago, and the trend is for the price to be falling, even if there are occasional bumps.

It states that the world's use of oil for energy has decreased from 50% in the 1970s, to 30% today. According to it, the vehicles industries are working to abolish oil-based fuel, and focus on electric fuels.

It also stated that in the US, it will probably be companies that lead the move toward becoming more climate-friendly, as the American government has typically been passive or negative toward international treaties seeking to limit emissions. As an example, it mentioned Amazon's recently stated aim to have zero carbon emissions by 2040, and that its deliveries should run on 100% renewables in 2030.

What do you think about this? It sounds very optimistic.

For those of you blessed with knowledge of Swedish, here is the article I am referring to: Seger för marknaden att oljan förlorat makt
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Online werecow

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Re: Climate Change Catchment Thread
« Reply #928 on: September 30, 2019, 05:45:19 PM »
You might think that the false idea that an ostrich buries it's head (they do not) would be allowed to die, and not be used as some mythological metaphor.

What ostrich? Those are Louisiana governor candidates, as clearly indicated by the subscript.
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Offline Gigabyte

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Re: Climate Change Catchment Thread
« Reply #929 on: September 30, 2019, 05:51:01 PM »
Using a false metaphor to insult is ironic, and not very effective.l
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