Author Topic: Why is Harrison Ford still flying?  (Read 3096 times)

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Offline estockly

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Why is Harrison Ford still flying?
« on: February 14, 2017, 08:24:50 PM »
Harrison Ford involved in close call at John Wayne Airport; FAA investigating - LA Times


http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-harrison-ford-plane-incident-20170214-story.html

Quote
"Air traffic controllers cleared the pilot of a single-engine Aviat Husky to land on Runway 20L at John Wayne Airport Monday afternoon. The pilot correctly read back the clearance. The pilot then landed on a taxiway that runs parallel to the runway, overflying a Boeing 737 that was holding short of the runway. The FAA is investigating," said FAA spokesman Ian Gregor.
and Donald Trump is President of the United States.


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Offline Fast Eddie B

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Re: Why is Harrison Ford still flying?
« Reply #1 on: February 14, 2017, 09:05:47 PM »
He will likely get a "709" ride with the FAA to confirm he's OK to continue his flying career.

Pilots are human and make mistakes. Sometimes even landing at the wrong airport.

Wrong runway or taxiway confusion happens. We sometimes see what we expect to see in a form of confirmation bias.

Anyway, I wish him luck.

As an aside, it's not specifically illegal to land on a taxiway. It would be more a matter of "Careless or Reckless" combined with not adhering to an ATC clearance.
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Offline Noisy Rhysling

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Re: Why is Harrison Ford still flying?
« Reply #2 on: February 14, 2017, 09:21:48 PM »
During WWII Japanese planes tried to land on USN carriers.
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Offline Andrew Clunn

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Re: Why is Harrison Ford still flying?
« Reply #3 on: February 14, 2017, 09:43:07 PM »
During WWII Japanese planes tried to land on USN carriers.

Would that be a failed kamikaze?
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Offline Tassie Dave

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Re: Why is Harrison Ford still flying?
« Reply #4 on: February 14, 2017, 11:11:03 PM »

Offline HighPockets

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Re: Why is Harrison Ford still flying?
« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2017, 02:49:24 PM »
You missed the best Han Soloish quote though...

Quote
“Was that airliner meant to be underneath me?” the pilot questioned an air traffic controller,

Seriously thought, if there is a 737 sitting at the end of a runway where you thought you were supposed to land, wouldn't you double check where you are supposed to be?
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Offline His Noodliness

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Re: Why is Harrison Ford still flying?
« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2017, 03:02:55 PM »
I'm a pilot. A few years ago on my way to Key West, I stopped off in Daytona to refuel. I turned final and got nicely lined up. My brother (not a pilot) then pointed and the bigger runway to the right and said, "Umm, isn't that the one you're supposed to land on?"

Umm, yeah. So I tweaked the yoke and got nicely lined up with the runway instead of taxiway.

My brother was much more alert for the rest of the trip.

Shit happens, y'all!

I can easily see Mr. Ford thinking that the airliner was covering up the runway identifiers (the big huge numbers on runways). In his mind, ATC told him to land on that runway and that's what he did, hopping right over an airliner. It's really, REALLY easy to not hit an airliner on the ground. He flew 100 feet OVER instead of 100 feet BESIDE the airliner. It wasn't dangerous but obviously broke the rules.

Offline jt512

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Re: Why is Harrison Ford still flying?
« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2017, 09:38:49 PM »
I'm a pilot. A few years ago on my way to Key West, I stopped off in Daytona to refuel. I turned final and got nicely lined up. My brother (not a pilot) then pointed and the bigger runway to the right and said, "Umm, isn't that the one you're supposed to land on?"

Umm, yeah. So I tweaked the yoke and got nicely lined up with the runway instead of taxiway.

My brother was much more alert for the rest of the trip.

Shit happens, y'all!

I can easily see Mr. Ford thinking that the airliner was covering up the runway identifiers (the big huge numbers on runways). In his mind, ATC told him to land on that runway and that's what he did, hopping right over an airliner. It's really, REALLY easy to not hit an airliner on the ground. He flew 100 feet OVER instead of 100 feet BESIDE the airliner. It wasn't dangerous but obviously broke the rules.

Are you really a pilot?  Mistaking a taxiway for a runway is unforgivable.  Do you really believe it's ok to land on a runway when it's occupied by another aircraft?  If you believe that you deserve to lose your pilot's license.  "Shit happens"?  I hope I never end up flying with you at the controls. 
I'm not going to use your pronouns.

Offline Fast Eddie B

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Re: Why is Harrison Ford still flying?
« Reply #8 on: February 15, 2017, 09:52:43 PM »

Are you really a pilot?  Mistaking a taxiway for a runway is unforgivable.  Do you really believe it's ok to land on a runway when it's occupied by another aircraft?  If you believe that you deserve to lose your pilot's license.  "Shit happens"?  I hope I never end up flying with you at the controls.

That's the kind of thing a non-pilot or a very low-time pilot might think and say.

Fly enough hours with enough pilots - I have about 4,500 hours just instructing - and you see things differently.

As an aside, it can be "ok" to land on a runway when it's "occupied" by another aircraft, but that's not what happened here, so why bring it up?
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Offline jt512

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Re: Why is Harrison Ford still flying?
« Reply #9 on: February 15, 2017, 10:10:21 PM »
As an aside, it can be "ok" to land on a runway when it's "occupied" by another aircraft, but that's not what happened here, so why bring it up?

Try reading for comprehension. 

Let me be more specific: the "pilot" to whom I was replying was trying to excuse Ford because he may have thought the airliner he landed over the top of might have been sitting on the runway markings obscuring them.  Are you going to tell me it's ok to fly over and land beyond an airplane that is sitting on the runway markings on the approach end of the runway without explicit approval from the tower and acknowledgement of the pilot of the plane on the runway?  And please don't bring up pilot's emergency authority. 
I'm not going to use your pronouns.

Offline Noisy Rhysling

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Re: Why is Harrison Ford still flying?
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2017, 07:00:48 AM »
During WWII Japanese planes tried to land on USN carriers.

Would that be a failed kamikaze?
Nope, the pilot made a very good approach to the carrier. The LSO said he would have been fine except for "forty or fifty 20- and 40mm guns firing at him."
"Sunday's horoscope is note worthy because of its strange, sudden and wholly unpredictable and inexplicable occurrences, affecting all phases of life." Your Horoscope" L.A. Evening Herald Express, Sat, 12/06/41

Offline Noisy Rhysling

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Re: Why is Harrison Ford still flying?
« Reply #11 on: February 16, 2017, 07:02:07 AM »
Do we have a history of such events with Ford?
"Sunday's horoscope is note worthy because of its strange, sudden and wholly unpredictable and inexplicable occurrences, affecting all phases of life." Your Horoscope" L.A. Evening Herald Express, Sat, 12/06/41

Offline Fast Eddie B

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Re: Why is Harrison Ford still flying?
« Reply #12 on: February 16, 2017, 07:08:36 AM »
Do we have a history of such events with Ford?

Not so much.

He handled an engine failure pretty well a few years ago. I believe there was a helicopter accident before that, but it was in training so would more reflect on the instructor than the student.

In a "709" ride, he'll go up with an FAA examiner to see if there is a problem. It's normal to have a gradual slide in facilities with age. It's not unusual for it to occur more rapidly. But many pilots stay sharp enough to fly into their 80's and even 90's, so it is possible.
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Offline bimble

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Re: Why is Harrison Ford still flying?
« Reply #13 on: February 16, 2017, 07:13:29 AM »
Do we have a history of such events with Ford?

I'm assuming people are remembering his crash from a few years back when his engine failed shortly after take off and he was unable to make it back to the airport. In that instance a spokesperson for the Santa Monica Airport Association said it was "an absolutely beautifully executed emergency landing by an unbelievably well-trained pilot".

Offline Fast Eddie B

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Re: Why is Harrison Ford still flying?
« Reply #14 on: February 16, 2017, 07:28:30 AM »
This appears to be a summary of past accidents:

http://www.airsafe.com/events/celebs/ford.htm

In the recent case, again human psychology can be a factor.

On some pilot forums, it's being suggested that after being concerned enough about the location of the passenger jet to query it, he should have "gone around", suspecting something was amiss. But pilots can fall victim to "task fixation". For him the "task" was to land, something he's done out of approaches with a near 100% success rate. It can be very, very difficult to tear oneself away from a task one is fixated upon. Conflicting input - missing runway markings, let's say - can simply not rise to the level of consciousness.

Not making excuses - he messed up. But there are reasons pilots (and doctors and engineers and police officers - and humans in general) continue to make the mistakes they do. By understanding those reasons we can attempt to improve training, but to err is human.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2017, 07:30:41 AM by Fast Eddie B »
"And what it all boils down to is that no one's really got it figured out just yet" - Alanis Morisette
• • •
"I doubt that!" - James Randi

 

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