Author Topic: Fasting Mimicking Diet  (Read 2589 times)

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Offline Gerbig

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Re: Fasting Mimicking Diet
« Reply #30 on: April 20, 2017, 10:57:17 PM »
Really, the only thing you can eat that doesnt result in your metabolism and other factors rising and falling is water.

Sugar free gum, calorie free things, even inedible objects result in your bodies digestive processes starting up, even if they dont do much.
I dont think the diet in the OP makes sense based on that.

Offline gmalivuk

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Re: Fasting Mimicking Diet
« Reply #31 on: April 21, 2017, 10:30:33 AM »
Muscle (and other tissue) are always breaking down. (Looks at Arnold today). You need to constantly store calories as muscle in order to maintain.
But you can only do that so much. Beyond that maintenance level, further excess calories still get stored as fat.
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Online The Latinist

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Re: Fasting Mimicking Diet
« Reply #32 on: April 21, 2017, 11:13:20 AM »
But not if you reach the magical state of nirvana ketosis.
I would like to propose...that...it is undesirable to believe in a proposition when there is no ground whatever for supposing it true. — Bertrand Russell

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Re: Fasting Mimicking Diet
« Reply #33 on: April 21, 2017, 01:16:44 PM »
But not if you reach the magical state of nirvana ketosis.

Even in the scientifically and medically documented state of nutritional ketosis, it's very difficult to reduce body fat percentage below a fairly reasonable threshold.

20 - 25%, for someone who was obese.

The higher one's peak body fat percentage, the higher the minimal stable body fat percentage would be.

This is not unique to LCHF Ketogenic diets, BTW. Even bariatric surgery patients report the same. Short of fasting (actual fasting not mimicking fasting) or lipo-suction I don't believe any diet plan can consistently do better.

and Donald Trump is President of the United States.


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Offline WeeDavie

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Re: Fasting Mimicking Diet
« Reply #34 on: May 19, 2017, 09:42:08 AM »
Why is it always the same debate on ketosis by folk who have no knowledge of the actual science?

low carb - Low protein - High Fat diet triggers a unique metabolic state that causes the consumption of less calories and weight loss, its established science with dozens upon dozens of studies proving it. PubMed is your friend.

The trigger for vertebrates physiology to enter starvation is not the lack of food but the consumption of body fat, burn just body fat and the physiology goes into starvation mode and limits the intake of ones own body fat to a minimum. The state can be easily triggered by simply eating nothing but the rendered down body fat of other vertebrates i.e. lard. Then your appetite goes to a minimal and you lose weight without feeling very hungry.

It works, but its awful and adding protein into it does make it tasty but simply results in the excess protein being converted sugar, and the metabolic state being switched off again. That's why the Aitkens diet doesn't work and no-one in their right mind will pay someone to feed them nothing lard with vitamins and minerals in it but we can happily force mice to do it.
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Re: Fasting Mimicking Diet
« Reply #35 on: May 19, 2017, 01:45:38 PM »
Why is it always the same debate on ketosis by folk who have no knowledge of the actual science?

Well, there is a serious disagreement  on ketosis and diet and nutrition within the scientific community where one side (who currently seem to have the consensus opinion) refuse to even recognize that anyone who disagrees with them is anything but a crank and charlatan. (And, no, I'm not referring to myself, here, I'm referring to a large number of scientists, physicians (including many specializing in obesity), researchers and academicians who are critical of the consensus opinion and promote a well supported alternative theory). Yes, PubMed is your friend.

Quote
low carb - Low protein - High Fat diet triggers a unique metabolic state that causes the consumption of less calories and weight loss, its established science with dozens upon dozens of studies proving it.

I know of no one who's promoting a low carb - Low protein - High Fat diet. The LCHF diets promoted by Atkins, including ketogenic diets, all have moderate protein, not low protein.

To achieve moderate protein in practice is pretty simple. Avoid high protein, low fat foods. Most of the food and food combinations approved for those diets are high fat with moderate to high protein, but with other high fat foods, the net effect is moderate protein.

Quote
The trigger for vertebrates physiology to enter starvation is not the lack of food but the consumption of body fat, burn just body fat and the physiology goes into starvation mode and limits the intake of ones own body fat to a minimum. The state can be easily triggered by simply eating nothing but the rendered down body fat of other vertebrates i.e. lard. Then your appetite goes to a minimal and you lose weight without feeling very hungry.

No one is advocating a diet that causes one to "burn just body fat" (except those who advocate fasting and intermittent fasting). What's being advocated is a diet that keeps insulin levels moderate, and causes the body to release more stored fat than it stores. The body then burns the released fat, along with fat consumed, and moderate amounts of glucose from the small amounts consumed and the glucose converted from protein.

Starvation mode is not the same as nutritional ketosis.

Quote
It works, but its awful and adding protein into it does make it tasty but simply results in the excess protein being converted sugar, and the metabolic state being switched off again. That's why the Aitkens diet doesn't work and no-one in their right mind will pay someone to feed them nothing lard with vitamins and minerals in it but we can happily force mice to do it.

Also, Atkins is not being fed nothing but lard with vitamins and minerals.

Where do you get the idea that the Atkins diet doesn't work? It's been tested and shown to work as well or better than any other diet strategy. Again, pubmed is your friend too.
and Donald Trump is President of the United States.


"Well, sometimes the magic works. Sometimes it doesn't." -- Chief Dan George, "Little Big Man"

Offline lonely moa

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Re: Fasting Mimicking Diet
« Reply #36 on: May 26, 2017, 02:10:54 AM »
Just fast.  Time tested and works a treat, even if one is not trying to lose weight. 

I like an eight hour eating window.   I eat as much as I like, weight stable, lots of energy and very healthy mitochondria.  Easy. 
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Re: Fasting Mimicking Diet
« Reply #37 on: May 26, 2017, 03:42:37 AM »
How can you tell that your mitichondria are healthy?

Offline lonely moa

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Re: Fasting Mimicking Diet
« Reply #38 on: May 26, 2017, 05:19:29 AM »
How can you tell that your mitichondria are healthy?

I'm healthy. 
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Offline gmalivuk

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Re: Fasting Mimicking Diet
« Reply #39 on: May 26, 2017, 07:43:26 AM »
Such impeccable logic.
The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better...is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides.

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Re: Fasting Mimicking Diet
« Reply #40 on: May 26, 2017, 08:20:17 PM »

Offline lonely moa

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Offline lonely moa

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Re: Fasting Mimicking Diet
« Reply #43 on: May 28, 2017, 12:47:52 AM »
How can you tell that your mitichondria are healthy?

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3946160/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3106288/
Thank you for this answer to a question I did not ask.

Mitochondria benefit from autophagy. Intermittent fasting encourages autophagy. 
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Re: Fasting Mimicking Diet
« Reply #44 on: May 28, 2017, 02:22:45 AM »
How can you tell that your mitichondria are healthy?

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3946160/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3106288/
Thank you for this answer to a question I did not ask.

Mitochondria benefit from autophagy. Intermittent fasting encourages autophagy.
Again, this is an answer to a question I did not ask.

The question I asked was "how can you tell that your mitochondria are healthy?"

You might be doing all of the things that are supposed to benefit the health of your mitochondria, and yet they're still unhealthy because of something else. My question was how can you tell that your mitochondria are healthy? You claim that they are healthy, which means that you must have some method of determining or measuring their health. What is that method?

 

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