Author Topic: Episode #655  (Read 6231 times)

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Offline werecow

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Re: Episode #655
« Reply #60 on: February 18, 2018, 06:13:04 AM »
Its actually surprisingly hard to find the correct pronunciation by googling. Bizarrely, no one seems to have just taken a sample of him introducing himself?

Anyway, scroll down to the UK english pronounciation here:
http://www.pronouncekiwi.com/Sir%20David%20Attenborough

Its really easy.

It's also really ambiguous, given that that page has five different pronunciations all labelled UK.
I only see two at the bottom of the list. They are both correct.

There are five on the page for me. But the lists appear to be sorted completely differently depending on whether I open it in firefox or chrome, so maybe your version looks different as well.
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Offline Harry Black

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Re: Episode #655
« Reply #61 on: February 18, 2018, 06:35:44 AM »
Im viewing on a phone.
Interesting.
Anyway, the ones I meant have moved up to the top because they got some votes? And weirdly so did the welsh and american pronounciations.

What I find really weird is that some people made youtube videos on how to pronounce his name but did so incorrectly.
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Offline Thordale

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Re: Episode #655
« Reply #62 on: February 18, 2018, 07:07:11 AM »
This is how you pronounce David Attenborough's name correctly.

http://myshetland.co.uk/attenborough/
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Offline daniel1948

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Re: Episode #655
« Reply #63 on: February 18, 2018, 01:10:30 PM »
Sounds like we're making an awful lot of fuss over whether to say a schwa or an oh. Has David himself ever commented on his feelings regarding "correct" pronunciation of his name? When I meet people, if I am confused over the pronunciation of their name, I ask them. Much more often than not, they say anything generally close is fine. My last name is difficult for a lot of people, and some people even inexplicably add a letter that is not there when they say it. I understand this, and I usually say "that's close enough." And I say it for them if they want. I really don't care. It annoys me when people who dislike me intentionally say my name as though it were actually an offensive word (which requires completely changing everything but the first and last phonemes). But it does not bother me, and I do not consider it impolite, when people get it wrong. Very few people get it right.

I'll bet dollars to doughnuts that David Attenborough really does not care if Americans pronounce his name as it looks to us. I'm prepared to alter my opinion if anyone has a statement from him on the subject.
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Offline Harry Black

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Re: Episode #655
« Reply #64 on: February 19, 2018, 07:32:16 AM »
I dont know Sir Davids opinion, but I know it does grate on a great many people with similar names or coming from oddly spelled places. I dont think they go home and cry into their pillows, but it just seems bizarre to me to know that I might be wrong about something so simple and take zero steps to address that.

I found this video and it does a good job of explaining some basic British pronunciation.
The woman in the video is an absolute delight to listen to so I think anyone who likes  the southern English accent will enjoy it. Only about 3min long.


Offline Thordale

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Re: Episode #655
« Reply #65 on: February 19, 2018, 09:19:40 AM »
I expect, being the total gentleman he is, Sir David would smile benevolently, suck it up and put it down to "two nations divided by a common language".

It is common courtesy to at least make an effort to learn to pronounce someone's surname.  It is not as though he has just arrived on our screens.
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Offline daniel1948

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Re: Episode #655
« Reply #66 on: February 19, 2018, 09:34:35 AM »
And yet neither he nor anyone he knows will ever hear me pronounce his name. I'm not sure I have ever said his name out loud until I saw this thread and said it to myself to see how it comes out. Must I learn to pronounce the name of every celebrity, because it would be rude to have, inside my head but never spoken out loud, an incorrect pronunciation? What about all those Welsh towns with names an American would never be able to pronounce based on their spellings? Must I learn them also because it would be rude not to?

"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." My name is difficult for most people to pronounce. It does not bother me in the least, as long as they don't intentionally turn it into an insulting word, as little kids often do to each other (and as one prison guard did all the time). Outside of that, it does not bother me at all, and I would not dream of insisting they learn to pronounce my name correctly.

I do not feel it is rude for people to mispronounce my name, and I do not feel it is rude for people to not bother to learn to pronounce my name.
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Offline arthwollipot

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Re: Episode #655
« Reply #67 on: February 19, 2018, 02:03:20 PM »
I do not feel it is rude for people to mispronounce my name, and I do not feel it is rude for people to not bother to learn to pronounce my name.
I do feel that it is rude for people to mispronounce my name, when the correct pronunciation has been provided. And I do feel that it is rude for people not to bother to learn to pronounce my name. I feel that it is very rude.
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Offline Harry Black

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Re: Episode #655
« Reply #68 on: February 19, 2018, 02:28:27 PM »
Again, mispronounciation is fine.
But at this point, if you have not clicked on any of the links or read any of the phonetic explanations we have provided, you are living in willful ignorance.

Offline gebobs

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Re: Episode #655
« Reply #69 on: February 20, 2018, 02:17:17 PM »
I bet Sir David mispronounces "jaguar" just like every other Brit.

Offline Fast Eddie B

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Re: Episode #655
« Reply #70 on: February 20, 2018, 03:49:44 PM »
I bet Sir David mispronounces "jaguar" just like every other Brit.

Around here, it often comes out as “JagWIRE”. Hard to imagine where that originated.

Offline God Bomb

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Re: Episode #655
« Reply #71 on: February 21, 2018, 09:12:52 PM »
Just don't end the name with a W sound and people will let it slide.  Same rule applies to Edinburgh.

At some point we just have to accept we will pronounce proper nouns differently depending on where we are from though.  How pretentious would it be if English speakers started dropping the S on "Paris", for example?  It would be correct.  But no one does it.  But like my above example people will complain endlessly about the pronunciation of Edinburgh and Glasgow.  I guess there are a lot of factors.  Is it an English name?  Is the difference because of an accent or a mispronounciation, etc.  For non-Americans we do it too, for years I never new how to pronounce "Arkansas" but after correction, I wouldn't mispronounce it again.  I would not then say "I don't care, this is how I say it."
I guess I don't have a point other than "It's complicated."
« Last Edit: February 21, 2018, 09:23:15 PM by God Bomb »
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Offline gebobs

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Re: Episode #655
« Reply #72 on: February 22, 2018, 11:46:06 AM »
Just don't end the name with a W sound and people will let it slide.  Same rule applies to Edinburgh.

I usually forget the phantom fourth syllable in Ed-in-burr-uh. No lack of craziness in the English language, but, out of curiosity, is there some explanation for that other than that's just the way it's said?

Quote
At some point we just have to accept we will pronounce proper nouns differently depending on where we are from though.  How pretentious would it be if English speakers started dropping the S on "Paris", for example?


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I never new how to pronounce "Arkansas" but after correction, I wouldn't mispronounce it again.

Why we pronounce Arkansas and Kansas differently...
http://www.businessinsider.com/why-we-pronounce-kansas-and-arkansas-differently-2014-2

Offline brilligtove

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Re: Episode #655
« Reply #73 on: February 22, 2018, 02:41:55 PM »
I was in my early 40's when I found out that ar-KAN-zis and AR-kan-saw were the same place.
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Offline daniel1948

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Re: Episode #655
« Reply #74 on: February 22, 2018, 02:51:59 PM »
Just don't end the name with a W sound and people will let it slide.  Same rule applies to Edinburgh.

I usually forget the phantom fourth syllable in Ed-in-burr-uh. No lack of craziness in the English language, but, out of curiosity, is there some explanation for that other than that's just the way it's said?

This may or may not apply in this particular case, but English underwent a significant change in pronunciation after the invention of movable type made printing common. Spelling became locked in while pronunciation remained fluid. There was the "great vowel shift," and probably other changes as well.

An interesting curiosity: Shakespeare and Cervantes were roughly contemporaries, but whereas most Americans have some difficulty reading and understanding Shakespeare, it is easy for a speaker of modern Spanish to read Cervantes. English has changed more than Spanish has in that period. I've read sixteenth-century Spanish with very little difficulty, once I got the hang of a few differences in orthography. (The stories of knight-errantry that Cervantes so excoriates really are as bad as he says.)
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