Author Topic: Should Islamic calls to prayers be permitted to be aired in public?  (Read 5515 times)

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Offline Quetzalcoatl

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In Sweden there is a political debate about if mosques should be allowed to air the Adhan, the Muslim call to prayer, in public, hearable to people outside of the mosque (they are of course allowed to do that inside the mosque). Such calls to prayer would of course be subject to the existing noise legislation that we have. For example, it would not be permitted to do so at 5 AM in the morning, waking people up.

- Those who argue in favor of it argue that as long as the calls to prayers follow the law, there is no problem. Church bells are allowed to ring in public, so why are calls to prayers considered differently?

- Those who argue against it argue that it is intrusive to play a loud religious message in public spaces. They argue that church bells are different because they don't have any message like the calls to prayer do, and that clock-ringing are used in many non-religious contexts as well (for example, schools), and therefore they can't be considered a purely religious thing, unlike the Islamic calls to prayers.

I wonder, what does it look like in other Western cities around the world (I assume cities in Islamic countries will be more tailored to Islamic customs)? Are Islamic calls to prayers being permitted to air in public areas, hearable to people outside of mosques?

Offline Harry Black

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Re: Should Islamic calls to prayers be permitted to be aired in public?
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2018, 04:24:57 PM »
Im against it.
I want fewer public displays of religion, not more. Especially on this level of intrusion.
In every muslim country I have visited, its been an absolute pain in the ass.

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Offline Calinthalus

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Re: Should Islamic calls to prayers be permitted to be aired in public?
« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2018, 04:32:54 PM »
As long as it's following existing noise regulations, it should be allowed.  I'm also allowed to blast Meshuggah at high volume as long as it doesn't break the same regulations.  I don't think a special case should be made for religion in either direction.
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Offline arthwollipot

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Re: Should Islamic calls to prayers be permitted to be aired in public?
« Reply #3 on: April 16, 2018, 04:38:45 PM »
To most non-Arabic speakers, the Adhan carries about as much meaning as a church bell. There are words there, but I doubt that most people in Sweden would understand them. It's effectively just a noise.
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Offline Shibboleth

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Re: Should Islamic calls to prayers be permitted to be aired in public?
« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2018, 12:25:41 PM »
Yes it should be allowed provided it doesn't break noise ordinances.
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Offline seamas

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Re: Should Islamic calls to prayers be permitted to be aired in public?
« Reply #5 on: April 17, 2018, 01:11:00 PM »
Yes it should be allowed provided it doesn't break noise ordinances.

Which are always ignored for motorcycles.

I would seriously prefer the call to prayers or church bells over the damned engine noise I hear in spring and summer evenings.

Offline random poet

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Re: Should Islamic calls to prayers be permitted to be aired in public?
« Reply #6 on: April 17, 2018, 01:28:22 PM »
They argue that church bells are different because they don't have any message like the calls to prayer do,
Church bells are absolutely a call to prayer. The whole point of church bells is to call the faithful to mass, or to mark the time of day where monks are supposed to pray.

The Adhan should be treated the same.
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Offline 2397

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Re: Should Islamic calls to prayers be permitted to be aired in public?
« Reply #7 on: April 17, 2018, 05:41:36 PM »
Don't have so much of an issue with church bells once a week, and a rare extra event sometimes. 5 times a day, every day, that is too much. I'd be okay with banning both, and I wouldn't like to have churches popping up that were doing it more often, but there is a significant difference between those two cases.

Offline Nosmas

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Re: Should Islamic calls to prayers be permitted to be aired in public?
« Reply #8 on: April 17, 2018, 05:47:43 PM »
While I'm against prayer and people wanting to partake or believing it has some power I can't say they shouldn't be allowed to do this if they abide by noise laws. If it isn't legal then that seems to be a special exception made for a religion which doesn't seem right. I guess I'm against it in the same way that I dislike hearing someone playing their favorite rap music outside.
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Offline random poet

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Re: Should Islamic calls to prayers be permitted to be aired in public?
« Reply #9 on: April 17, 2018, 05:55:37 PM »
While I'm against prayer and people wanting to partake or believing it has some power I can't say they shouldn't be allowed to do this if they abide by noise laws. If it isn't legal then that seems to be a special exception made for a religion which doesn't seem right. I guess I'm against it in the same way that I dislike hearing someone playing their favorite rap music outside.
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Offline Soldier of FORTRAN

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Re: Should Islamic calls to prayers be permitted to be aired in public?
« Reply #10 on: April 17, 2018, 06:22:29 PM »
If it's compliant with local ordinances, sure. 

And I expect the reality of five calls per day (indefinitely) would prompt some adjustments in non-Muslim majority areas.
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Offline Harry Black

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Re: Should Islamic calls to prayers be permitted to be aired in public?
« Reply #11 on: April 17, 2018, 06:57:37 PM »
If it's compliant with local ordinances, sure. 

And I expect the reality of five calls per day (indefinitely) would prompt some adjustments in non-Muslim majority areas.
You mean people would convert?

I have no idea what local ordinances stipulate in my own area, let alone others. I know I dont hear churchbells in my current city and Im glad of that.
If it were loud enough to disturb me, I wouldnt be happy about it at all.

Offline Enkidu Shamesh

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Re: Should Islamic calls to prayers be permitted to be aired in public?
« Reply #12 on: April 18, 2018, 12:57:09 AM »
Here we are having a polite discussion about whether people who are not breaking any existing laws (like noise ordinances) should be banned from doing something because of their religion. This is right up there with "should we ban sharia law" as if we need special laws for the scary Muslims. Why are we entertaining this question? This is why people say "I don't believe in God but I'm not an atheist." This is an asshole discussion to even be having.

Offline Henning

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Re: Should Islamic calls to prayers be permitted to be aired in public?
« Reply #13 on: April 18, 2018, 03:36:15 AM »
It's a thing I didn't think about before, which I now have a dispassionate discussion to form an opinion from.
The opinion, like everyone's here, is "meh"... which apparently is yours too, only moreso.
I think it's an asshole and counter-productive thing to say the discussion shouldn't even exist. Served its purpose in my case...
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Offline Eternally Learning

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Re: Should Islamic calls to prayers be permitted to be aired in public?
« Reply #14 on: April 18, 2018, 05:45:24 AM »
Here we are having a polite discussion about whether people who are not breaking any existing laws (like noise ordinances) should be banned from doing something because of their religion. This is right up there with "should we ban sharia law" as if we need special laws for the scary Muslims. Why are we entertaining this question? This is why people say "I don't believe in God but I'm not an atheist." This is an asshole discussion to even be having.

Hadn't thought about it before and the predominant view seems to be that if it's abiding by the noise ordinances then it should be allowed.  The reason people say "I don't believe in God but I'm not an atheist," is because they are uninterested in all the atheists who espouse reasonable views and instead favor forming an overly simplistic opinion about a highly variable group of people.  The assholes are not the ones interested in discussing current events and forming a reasonable opinion, the assholes are the ones attempting to shut down the conversations with judgey derision.

 

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