Author Topic: Penn's weight loss book  (Read 1229 times)

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Offline John Albert

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Re: Penn's weight loss book
« Reply #30 on: December 09, 2018, 01:45:39 PM »
By this point no one should be confused

Except maybe Vinnie Barbarino.


Offline stands2reason

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Re: Penn's weight loss book
« Reply #31 on: December 09, 2018, 02:07:40 PM »
Only the middle paragraph of my previous post was about carbs or macronutrients. But it still wasn't about LCHF diet. I brought it up because the point is relevant: fiber basically doesn't have calories but is something that makes you feel full, another element of a healthy diet that too many people are lacking.

There is medical evidence that LSD cures other kinds of addictions such as alcohol and heroin. That was one of the first demonstated uses for it, before it became a scheduled drug, and after it was re-approved for medical testing.

You could argue that people with food addiction have a different kind of mental problem. Is it a psychological addiction to the taste of food, or the experience of eating out? Or are they "miswired" so that they have a physical addiction to the process of consuming calories, or consuming certain kinds of calories, blood sugar spike, feeling full, or similar. The reason I point that out is that alcohol and heroin addiction eventually become physical addictions, based on their neurotransmitter effects, but they can still be reversed with sufficiently powerful psychedelics.

There is also preliminary evidence that eating disorders are highly correlated with trauma. And psychedelics are demonstated to be effective in curing PTSD, not just LSD but also MDMA, psilocybin, and ketamine.

BTW, for those that have read the book, does Penn give numbers on calories per day or macronutrient ratios?

Offline CarbShark

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Re: Penn's weight loss book
« Reply #32 on: December 09, 2018, 02:16:31 PM »
Only the middle paragraph of my previous post was about carbs or macronutrients. But it still wasn't about LCHF diet. I brought it up because the point is relevant: fiber basically doesn't have calories but is something that makes you feel full, another element of a healthy diet that too many people are lacking.

The main point I was disagreeing with was that there is a consensus on the "Calories in/Calories out" theory. There's not. And that's the part of the discussion we could carry on in the LCHF thread.

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There is medical evidence that LSD cures other kinds of addictions such as alcohol and heroin. That was one of the first demonstated uses for it, before it became a scheduled drug, and after it was re-approved for medical testing.

You could argue that people with food addiction have a different kind of mental problem. Is it a psychological addiction to the taste of food, or the experience of eating out? Or are they "miswired" so that they have a physical addiction to the process of consuming calories, or consuming calories, blood sugar spike, feeling full, or similar.

I happen to believe that sugar and carb addiction is very similar to addiction of alcohol and heroin, but, no, recommending LSD (or any psychotropic or hallucinatory substance) for food addition when it hasn't been specifically tested and found safe and effective for food addition, is not scientific.

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BTW, for those that have read the book, does Penn give numbers on calories per day or macronutrient rarios?

That's a good question. I was thinking about the audio book, but as much as I like Penn's writing, sometimes I find his voice grating, so I may get the book.
and Donald Trump is President of the United States.

I'm not a doctor, I'm just someone who has done a ton of research into diet and nutrition.

Offline bachfiend

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Re: Penn's weight loss book
« Reply #33 on: December 19, 2018, 03:16:10 AM »
Why are you so willing to accept Penn’s anecdote, but so vehemently reject my anecdote ...

I don't accept Penn's anecdote, Dr. Readingcomprehension.

Here's the difference:

Penn is very sharp, witty and LOL funny in his writing, and at the same time he's a skeptic and probably put some thought and research into his decision. That makes his writing worth reading, but his anecdote is just as worthless as yours (or mine).

No, he didn’t put any thought or research into his decision.  His doctor advised him to have a gastric sleeve procedure, and he realised that his doctor telling him that gave him permission to call himself obese (as he was).

His diet plan was prescribed by Ray Cronise (who has written a book).

The diet plan is pretty radical, starting with two weeks of nothing but potatoes, with nothing else.  No butter, no salt, no dressings, nothing else.  But as many potatoes as he wants.  Followed by sweet corn.  But nothing else.  And then a completely plant-based diet.

There’s much I’d agree with.  It’s a radical diet, forcing the dieter to give up a lot of the bad habits causing the person to overeat and become overweight and obese over years and decades.  Such as eating anywhere and everywhen.  And when bored.  Or to be social.

Actually, the diet he was told to adopt has many features of my diet and diet strategy (but not all).  The main commonality is intermittent fasting.  I have all my meals with a 4 hour window each day.  He just has one meal a day, in the evening before his show.  He doesn’t count calories or carbohydrates.

The idea of eating just one food, potatoes or sweet corn, for weeks was to re-educate his tastebuds to the taste of food, instead of overpowering everything with salt, sugar or fat.  By the way, you can’t be addicted to salt, sugar or fat, but you certainly can be habituated to salt, sugar or fat.

You’re probably as ‘addicted’ to fat, as you seem to believe other people are ‘addicted’ to sugar.
« Last Edit: December 19, 2018, 02:56:26 PM by bachfiend »
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Offline bachfiend

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Re: Penn's weight loss book
« Reply #34 on: December 20, 2018, 05:50:59 PM »
Well, I’ve just finished the audiobook.  I loved it.  It was very entertaining.

You can’t argue with a diet plan that allowed a person to lose almost 50 kg in body weight in a season.  And get off most of his anti-hypertensive medications.  I really can’t find much to criticise about the plan he was prescribed.

His maintenance diet is whole-plant food based ‘un-ethical veganism.’  Meaning no bread - which I’d have difficulty with, I love the smell of hot bread.  And intermittent fasting, having all his calories within a 16 hour window (sometimes fasting for more than a day), which is more ‘natural’ than the fad Paleo diet.  And it’s certainly not the fad low carbohydrate/high fat ketogenic diet.  He correctly identifies the problem with the Standard American Diet as being too much sugar, too much salt, and too much fat.  And eating everywhere and at any time.

I recommend the book just for its entertainment.
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Offline bachfiend

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Re: Penn's weight loss book
« Reply #35 on: December 29, 2018, 09:05:37 PM »
I’ve almost reached the end of my planned two week trial of enhanced intermittent fasting with one meal a day between 5-6 pm.  It’s easier than I thought.  My weight has stabilised at 60.7 kg, body fat percentage of 12% (to be taken with a grain of salt) and a BMI of 18.9 kg/m^2.  And I feel good.   I might persist with it.
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Offline superdave

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Re: Penn's weight loss book
« Reply #36 on: January 02, 2019, 10:56:39 AM »
Steve Novella has pointed out on the podcast manytimes that while anecdotes are not data they are a starting point that raises questions.  I think the book makes some good points about the psychology of being obese and the quality of the america diet.  Maybe that stuff spoke to me more as a person who is over 6 foot tall than it might to other people. 
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Offline bachfiend

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Re: Penn's weight loss book
« Reply #37 on: January 02, 2019, 06:55:06 PM »
Steve Novella has pointed out on the podcast manytimes that while anecdotes are not data they are a starting point that raises questions.  I think the book makes some good points about the psychology of being obese and the quality of the america diet.  Maybe that stuff spoke to me more as a person who is over 6 foot tall than it might to other people.

One of the points Penn Jillette makes is that the standard American diet is high in sugar, salt and fat, which blunts the taste for other flavours.  His diet started off with just eating potatoes, and nothing else (no fat, no salt, no butter), for two weeks to get back his sense of taste, at the end of which he came to appreciate the rich taste of potatoes and came to enjoy them.

His diet now is vegan plant-based, which he says is delicious and very enjoyable.

The value of anecdotes is that they provide possible strategies that actually worked in at least one person, and that are possibly worth trying.  There’s no harm in trying it.  If it doesn’t work, no harm has been done.
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