Author Topic: Game of Thrones Season 8 Discussion [SPOILERS FOR LATEST EPISODES]  (Read 10017 times)

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Offline CarbShark

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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8 Discussion [SPOILERS FOR LATEST EPISODES]
« Reply #390 on: May 27, 2019, 01:37:23 PM »
Given her multiple betrayals and increased isolation, and the biggest threat to her claim to the throne coming from her true love, who is now distant from her and closer to her rivals, how did you expect her to act?


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Offline Captain Video

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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8 Discussion [SPOILERS FOR LATEST EPISODES]
« Reply #391 on: May 27, 2019, 02:08:14 PM »
I watched the wrap up documentary last night and really enjoyed it.

They highlighted many of the lesser known jobs which is always great, even the extras. I think its cool that no mater where in the world they are shooting things work mostly the same. There were a few differences. For instance I see over there they have to pay for their own craft services (she does not take credit LOL) and the Locations Manager was directing truck parking which is a transportation coordinator job here. (Both are Teamsters)

The SFX guy laying down the snow and stressing how he could only lay it down in a few locations at a time was beautiful. I have heard the exact same complaints before. BTW Im convinced the temperature drops 5 degrees when they put that stuff down even though its made of cellulose. It fools your brain.

The locations manager explaining the logistics of handling that many extras was also cool.

Stress was shown everywhere but like all film workers they fight through it.

its worth a watch.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2019, 02:17:28 PM by Captain Video »
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Offline The Latinist

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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8 Discussion [SPOILERS FOR LATEST EPISODES]
« Reply #392 on: May 27, 2019, 02:19:07 PM »
I'm glad it worked for you, but your own experience cannot be universalized.  Enough people clearly did not believe Danaerys' actions that it is clear the show runners were not successful in developing that her character was capable of murdering hundreds of thousands of innocent people. It's not that we are not seeing the things that you are; we just don't think that they are adequate to tell the story convincingly.
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Offline CarbShark

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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8 Discussion [SPOILERS FOR LATEST EPISODES]
« Reply #393 on: May 27, 2019, 02:19:15 PM »
We started watching it but planned to switch to something else if it was dull or sappy.

We watched the whole thing. I particularly liked the stuntman who played the night king and the whole sequence showing the choreography involved in Arya’s attack.


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Offline CarbShark

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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8 Discussion [SPOILERS FOR LATEST EPISODES]
« Reply #394 on: May 27, 2019, 02:20:07 PM »
We started watching the behind the scenes documentary  but planned to switch to something else if it was dull or sappy.

We watched the whole thing. I particularly liked the stuntman who played the night king and the whole sequence showing the choreography involved in Arya’s attack.


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Offline CarbShark

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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8 Discussion [SPOILERS FOR LATEST EPISODES]
« Reply #395 on: May 27, 2019, 02:20:43 PM »
I'm glad it worked for you, but your own experience cannot be universalized.  Enough people clearly did not believe Danaerys' actions that it is clear the show runners were not successful in developing that her character was capable of murdering hundreds of thousands of innocent people. It's not that we are not seeing the things that you are; we just don't think that they are adequate to tell the story convincingly.
So, again, how did you expect her to react?


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Offline The Latinist

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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8 Discussion [SPOILERS FOR LATEST EPISODES]
« Reply #396 on: May 27, 2019, 03:07:42 PM »
I'm glad it worked for you, but your own experience cannot be universalized.  Enough people clearly did not believe Danaerys' actions that it is clear the show runners were not successful in developing that her character was capable of murdering hundreds of thousands of innocent people. It's not that we are not seeing the things that you are; we just don't think that they are adequate to tell the story convincingly.
So, again, how did you expect her to react?

As I said earlier in the thread, it would be in keeping with her character to burn the Red Keep, to kill Jon, to burn the Lannister army in battle, or to execute anyone who, at the end of the battle, refused to bend the knee.  It is not in keeping with her character as showed on screen to burn hundreds of thousands of innocent people--men, women, and children--whose only crime was to take refuge from coming war inside the city and who had already surrendered.  To get her to the point where that was a convincing plot turn would require a hell of a lot more setup than we saw in this season.
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Offline Guillermo

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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8 Discussion [SPOILERS FOR LATEST EPISODES]
« Reply #397 on: May 27, 2019, 03:45:07 PM »
Nothing Cercei had done turned him against her.
Well, except for sending Bronn to kill him but whatever turns people on.
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Offline Guillermo

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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8 Discussion [SPOILERS FOR LATEST EPISODES]
« Reply #398 on: May 27, 2019, 03:50:12 PM »
I'm glad it worked for you, but your own experience cannot be universalized.  Enough people clearly did not believe Danaerys' actions that it is clear the show runners were not successful in developing that her character was capable of murdering hundreds of thousands of innocent people. It's not that we are not seeing the things that you are; we just don't think that they are adequate to tell the story convincingly.
So, again, how did you expect her to react?


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To burn down the red keep, ignore Thousands of casualties while she is doing that. This appeared to be what she was doing after the bells as she flew straight for the red keep until she forgot what she was doing and started burning people and delaying the burning of the keep.
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Offline CarbShark

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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8 Discussion [SPOILERS FOR LATEST EPISODES]
« Reply #399 on: May 27, 2019, 05:14:52 PM »
You see that’s exactly how I would have expected her to act had she never been betrayed and had not lost those close to her.

But she changed. I didn’t need her to say “ I’m here to chew gum or raze a city and I’m all out of gum” to realize that her grief heartbreak and isolation had an effect.




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Offline Guillermo

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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8 Discussion [SPOILERS FOR LATEST EPISODES]
« Reply #400 on: May 28, 2019, 09:32:16 AM »
Really? Cause that wasn't the direction of the narrative. Had she never been betrayed, she would likely have been as lenient as she had been on her previous encounters with her enemies. She was willing to accept her enemies to bend the knee. After breaking, she is taking no quarters. This makes sense.

When she wasn't being betrayed and isolated, she was hearing out all of the advisers plan, and holding back. So having not being betrayed she would have clearly heard the advise of his advisers which was to back down after the bells. Considering that this is all assuming no betrayal and having both her dragon's and her sundae, cause that is what she has been doing all along. The betrayal and the lost close ones, broke her and She stops hearing advise and dose her thing.

The thing is Carb. If you have Your worst enemy on your left and a random innocent civilian on the right. Why would someone like Danery's even in a madden frenzy would go after the innocent first?
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Offline The Latinist

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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8 Discussion [SPOILERS FOR LATEST EPISODES]
« Reply #401 on: May 28, 2019, 09:39:43 AM »
But she changed.

But, as I said, they did not sell that change.  You may have bought it, but they didn't sell it.
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Offline Calinthalus

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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8 Discussion [SPOILERS FOR LATEST EPISODES]
« Reply #402 on: May 28, 2019, 11:40:42 AM »
The thing is, I don't think she changed.  I think she made up her mind that she had to make an example of Kings Landing way back when Jon wouldn't give her the Dick of The North and she decided she could never be accepted in Westeros by any means other than fear.  She knew that if she just let Cercei bend the knee after her bullshit she would never hold the seven kingdoms together and would face challenges from everywhere from Dorne to Winterfell.  However, by eradicating a city worth of civilians as punishment people would not dare stand against her.  It wasn't crazy...it was ruthless, as she has always been.
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Offline CarbShark

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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8 Discussion [SPOILERS FOR LATEST EPISODES]
« Reply #403 on: May 28, 2019, 11:56:56 AM »
The thing is, I don't think she changed.  I think she made up her mind that she had to make an example of Kings Landing way back when Jon wouldn't give her the Dick of The North and she decided she could never be accepted in Westeros by any means other than fear.  She knew that if she just let Cercei bend the knee after her bullshit she would never hold the seven kingdoms together and would face challenges from everywhere from Dorne to Winterfell.  However, by eradicating a city worth of civilians as punishment people would not dare stand against her.  It wasn't crazy...it was ruthless, as she has always been.

I agree with most of that.

The change came when she realized that Jon had a better claim to the throne, and that the people of Westeros and their leaders loved him more than her. At that point she had no advisors she could trust and was all alone.

She had said that she’d rather rule by love but would rule by fear if need be.

I wouldn’t go so far as to say it wasn’t crazy. But it was ruthless and calculated and within her character.




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Offline Harry Black

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Re: Game of Thrones Season 8 Discussion [SPOILERS FOR LATEST EPISODES]
« Reply #404 on: May 30, 2019, 06:42:16 AM »
The thing is, I don't think she changed.  I think she made up her mind that she had to make an example of Kings Landing way back when Jon wouldn't give her the Dick of The North and she decided she could never be accepted in Westeros by any means other than fear.  She knew that if she just let Cercei bend the knee after her bullshit she would never hold the seven kingdoms together and would face challenges from everywhere from Dorne to Winterfell.  However, by eradicating a city worth of civilians as punishment people would not dare stand against her.  It wasn't crazy...it was ruthless, as she has always been.
But it was really reallly stupid.
Which she had never been.

And all of the excuses for her behaviour ignore the D&D explanation from their interview which states that when she heard the bells it became 'personal'.
So she hadnt always intended to do it. It was an emotional decision. But it was already personal after Missandei was beheaded in front of her and instead of going for the perpetrators she went after civilians.

I think thats why they didnt show interviews after the final episode because they realised that the writers explanations were outing it as poorly written.

Look at John Wick. His wife died, his dog murdered, he gets back into the life he escaped to punish those responsible for his misery.
He didnt go and shoot up a mall. Which would be REALLY stupid character development and gratuitous spectacle. But the greatest tv show of all time cant even rise to the basic level of competancy of a dumb action flick in this regard.
It leaves it in the dust in most other regards, but this is a genuine flaw and was a mistake on the part of the writers. That in itself is not the end of the world or a reason not to love it any way.