Author Topic: What's going on at the Atheist Experience?  (Read 718 times)

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Offline daniel1948

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Re: What's going on at the Atheist Experience?
« Reply #15 on: July 24, 2019, 10:37:45 AM »
Maybe instead of having women's sports and mens sports (with their associated locker rooms) we need to have penis sports and no-penis sports with their associated locker rooms??? Public rest rooms could have an attendant, and instead of men's rooms and women's rooms there'd be penis rooms and no-penis rooms and to get in you'd have to show the attendant whether you have a penis or not. Of course, the attendants would also have to show whether they had a penis or not because people entering would not want to show their penis to someone who didn't have a penis, or their lack of penis to someone who had a penis.
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Offline stands2reason

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Re: What's going on at the Atheist Experience?
« Reply #16 on: July 24, 2019, 10:51:43 AM »
Jesus, it's like a penis is a concealed weapon or something...

Offline mindme

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Re: What's going on at the Atheist Experience?
« Reply #17 on: July 24, 2019, 11:26:16 AM »
Jesus, it's like a penis is a concealed weapon or something...

My feeling is these women who oppose trans people in female locker room have had bad experiences with the person the penis was attached to. That is, they've been sexually assaulted by a human with a penis and the penis was used in the sexual assault. I have some sympathy if that's truly their position.
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Re: What's going on at the Atheist Experience?
« Reply #18 on: July 24, 2019, 03:08:33 PM »
As I've said in other threads on the topic of transgender athletics, it is a complex issue to which I know of no satisfactory answer. There are real benefits to providing opportunities for athletic participation and success to women and girls (including transgender women and girls), and there exists at least a plausible argument that participation of transgender women and girls in women's sports could negatively affect those opportunities for cisgender women. Would it, in fact, do so? I don't know, and I don't think anyone knows. It may be that there is a fundamental conflict between justice for transgender woman athletes and cisgender women athletes, and we will have to settle on a utilitarian solution. In the meantime, I don't think I'd label anyone merely trying to discuss the issue transphobic (though, of course, things like misgendering and fear-mongering about locker rooms would be evidence for transphobia, and I do not know any of the details of this case--nor do I really have any desire to).
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Offline PANTS!

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Re: What's going on at the Atheist Experience?
« Reply #19 on: July 24, 2019, 04:11:05 PM »
I found this 2 hour YouTube audio-only conversation, which I haven't listened to yet, but it's Kevin Logan "Speaking with Tracie Harris, Jen Peeples & Clare Wuellner about the split within the ACA".



Can you summarize?  2 hours is just too much.
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Offline John Albert

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Re: What's going on at the Atheist Experience?
« Reply #20 on: July 24, 2019, 05:10:18 PM »
Russell Glasser left the ACA awhile ago, reportedly for personal and professional reasons unrelated to the atheist community.

Matt Dillahunty seems to be a forgiving sort, willing to offer the benefit of the doubt to those who demonstrate sufficient open-mindedness to change their minds and renounce former noxious beliefs.

Others seem to be of the opinion that once somebody airs their bad views in public, the irrevocable damage has been done and those people must be shunned from the community.

Offline 2397

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Re: What's going on at the Atheist Experience?
« Reply #21 on: July 24, 2019, 05:21:11 PM »
Can you summarize?  2 hours is just too much.

Listened to most of the first hour of the above video (there's not a consistent sound level, so I definitely missed some of it). Overall it sounds like they were frustrated by the lack of a public response from the ACA/the Atheist Experience on the issue, and the poor handling of their community and social media presence, rather than specific ideological disagreements.

I have not listened to the rest of it.

Offline jt512

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Re: What's going on at the Atheist Experience?
« Reply #22 on: July 24, 2019, 11:19:28 PM »
I've never heard of any of the people or podcasts mentioned above.

Consider yourself lucky.


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Offline jt512

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What's going on at the Atheist Experience?
« Reply #23 on: July 24, 2019, 11:31:07 PM »
As I've said in other threads on the topic of transgender athletics, it is a complex issue to which I know of no satisfactory answer.

The answer is simple and obvious.  Everybody competes according to the sex to which they were born.

ETA:  Wrong. See below.



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« Last Edit: July 24, 2019, 11:48:57 PM by jt512 »
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Re: What's going on at the Atheist Experience?
« Reply #24 on: July 24, 2019, 11:35:14 PM »
As I've said in other threads on the topic of transgender athletics, it is a complex issue to which I know of no satisfactory answer.

The answer is simple and obvious.  Everybody competes according to the sex to which they were born.

What about people who were born women, but have a penis?
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Offline jt512

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Re: What's going on at the Atheist Experience?
« Reply #25 on: July 24, 2019, 11:38:32 PM »
As I've said in other threads on the topic of transgender athletics, it is a complex issue to which I know of no satisfactory answer.

The answer is simple and obvious.  Everybody competes according to the sex to which they were born.



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ETA: On second thought all trans people should compete as men. Explanation below.


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Offline jt512

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Re: What's going on at the Atheist Experience?
« Reply #26 on: July 24, 2019, 11:44:45 PM »
As I've said in other threads on the topic of transgender athletics, it is a complex issue to which I know of no satisfactory answer.

The answer is simple and obvious.  Everybody competes according to the sex to which they were born.

What about people who were born women, but have a penis?

Genitalia is not the issue. But my comment above was wrong. Rather, all trans people should be required to compete as males. Reason: Testosterone.


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Offline Belgarath

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Re: What's going on at the Atheist Experience?
« Reply #27 on: July 25, 2019, 08:58:35 AM »
As I've said in other threads on the topic of transgender athletics, it is a complex issue to which I know of no satisfactory answer.

The answer is simple and obvious.  Everybody competes according to the sex to which they were born.

What about people who were born women, but have a penis?

Genitalia is not the issue. But my comment above was wrong. Rather, all trans people should be required to compete as males. Reason: Testosterone.


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Ok, that's the stupidest thing I've read yet in this thread.

I'd like to associate myself with The Latinist's thoughts.  Breaking something like this down to 'oh testosterone' is absolutely stupid.

As I've said in other threads on the topic of transgender athletics, it is a complex issue to which I know of no satisfactory answer. There are real benefits to providing opportunities for athletic participation and success to women and girls (including transgender women and girls), and there exists at least a plausible argument that participation of transgender women and girls in women's sports could negatively affect those opportunities for cisgender women. Would it, in fact, do so? I don't know, and I don't think anyone knows. It may be that there is a fundamental conflict between justice for transgender woman athletes and cisgender women athletes, and we will have to settle on a utilitarian solution. In the meantime, I don't think I'd label anyone merely trying to discuss the issue transphobic (though, of course, things like misgendering and fear-mongering about locker rooms would be evidence for transphobia, and I do not know any of the details of this case--nor do I really have any desire to).

With all that being said, Woodford's video was really insensitive, had errors in it, and could have been done much better, it wasn't meant to inform, it was structured to get youtube clicks.  First no Joe Rogan clips, especially short ones where he just shouts 'That's a MAN!'  Then Woodford's apology was done very poorly.  Now, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt because I don't really see a pattern of behavior.  The ACA on the other hand should have just made a condemnation statement and left it at that.  They shouldn't have 'retracted' it, they should have just let it stand and moved on. 
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Offline Ah.hell

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Re: What's going on at the Atheist Experience?
« Reply #28 on: July 25, 2019, 09:31:52 AM »
Jesus, it's like a penis is a concealed weapon or something...
They have effectively been used as such.

Offline daniel1948

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Re: What's going on at the Atheist Experience?
« Reply #29 on: July 25, 2019, 10:30:35 AM »
There really is a better solution: Athletics should not be competitive! It should be a fun way to get exercise in an atmosphere where people work together, not just within your own team, but among teams. As long as there's competition there will be unfair advantages due to birth, environment, access to resources, and cheating. And as long as athletics are based on competition, the people at the bottom of the athletic-ability ladder, who need exercise the most, will be discouraged from getting any at all. Eliminate competition and it won't matter if somebody has a penis or not.
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