Author Topic: Episode #734  (Read 1685 times)

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Offline daniel1948

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Re: Episode #734
« Reply #15 on: August 04, 2019, 09:52:00 PM »
... false factoids shouldn’t make it into the show. ...

Agreed. But the SGU is basically an amateur production by unpaid volunteers (except Jay who now gets paid for, I presume, production work.) I think they do a pretty damn good job overall. Yes, the occasional error gets in. I still find it entertaining and informative.
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Offline bachfiend

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Re: Episode #734
« Reply #16 on: August 04, 2019, 10:38:32 PM »
All factoids are false because they are factoids and not facts.

‘Factoid’ has different meanings:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Factoid

I generally use it in the same way as ‘factlet,’ a trivial, but interesting, piece of information, which could be true or false.

I recently read an account of the 1902 destruction of St Pierre, in which the author discussing pyroclastic surges noted that water dissociates at temperatures higher than 600 degrees Fahrenheit, and doesn’t recombine until the temperature drops below 600 degrees, ‘explaining’ the areas of glowing within the surges, which I found interesting, but false.  Water, apparently, doesn’t dissociate until the temperature is above 2000 degrees Celsius, which is much hotter than pyroclastic surges.
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Offline stands2reason

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Re: Episode #734
« Reply #17 on: August 04, 2019, 11:23:26 PM »
But, the most likely explanation is mis-remembering, or loaded dice.

Offline gebobs

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Re: Episode #734
« Reply #18 on: August 05, 2019, 09:47:29 AM »
OK.  But false factoids shouldn’t make it into the show.

Here's to the endless pursuit of perfection.

Quote
It’s been shown that even if false factoids are mentioned, and then shown to be false, people (owing to the vagaries of memory) often tend to believe that the false factoids are actually true.

Indeed. All the more reason for us to continue using our skeptical antennae even when information comes from an otherwise trustworthy source.

Of course, there's actually a regular segment in the show which purposefully presents a fiction so be careful to guard against misremembering them as science. :-)

Offline Belgarath

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Re: Episode #734
« Reply #19 on: August 05, 2019, 12:05:36 PM »
Chinese culture is based entirely around dishonesty and lies. They have made dishonesty into a cornerstone of their societal philosophy in the same way that western societies value freedom and equality.

This seems like quite the bigoted and racist statement.  It's akin to 'all black people are dirty thieves'

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Offline daniel1948

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Re: Episode #734
« Reply #20 on: August 05, 2019, 02:06:54 PM »
Chinese culture is based entirely around dishonesty and lies. They have made dishonesty into a cornerstone of their societal philosophy in the same way that western societies value freedom and equality.

This seems like quite the bigoted and racist statement.  It's akin to 'all black people are dirty thieves'

GodHead has previously displayed a virulent hatred for the Chinese. I wonder if maybe a Chinese kid beat him up when he was little. Or perhaps his family suffered under Mao. In any case, his ideas are most certainly offensive and irrational.
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"Anyone who has ever looked into the glazed eyes of a soldier dying on the battlefield will think long and hard before starting a war."
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Offline Ah.hell

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Re: Episode #734
« Reply #21 on: August 05, 2019, 03:09:10 PM »
Can I ask a meta question?

If godhead had said, "Chinese Communists" instead of just "chinese" would it still be racist?


Offline DevoutCatalyst

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Re: Episode #734
« Reply #22 on: August 05, 2019, 03:17:09 PM »
Can I ask a meta question?

If godhead had said, "Chinese Communists" instead of just "chinese" would it still be racist?

He said Chinese culture.

Offline mabell_yah

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Re: Episode #734
« Reply #23 on: August 05, 2019, 06:03:17 PM »
Wow the probability was really an ass grab. Rolling doubles on a 6 sided die is 1:6 rolling them 6 times is 1:46,656 even rolling double 6es 6 times is only 1:2,176,782,336 3 orders of magnitude smaller than what is claimed.

I thought the same thing. Then I read the actual article:
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/connecting-coincidence/201907/how-skeptics-misapply-the-law-very-large-numbers

The prediction was "that they [husband and wife] were about to roll matching descending doubles, from six to one". They each rolled double 6s, then double 5s down through the 2s. Stricken by doubt, the husband failed to roll doubles on the final roll. That's a sequence of 20 individual die rolls. The probability calculation is legit. Never mind that the prediction of 24 die rolls was false.

Offline Ah.hell

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Re: Episode #734
« Reply #24 on: August 05, 2019, 06:05:30 PM »
Can I ask a meta question?

If godhead had said, "Chinese Communists" instead of just "chinese" would it still be racist?

He said Chinese culture.
Well then, if he had said, "Chinese Communist culture" instead? 

There does seem to be significant cultural differences between Taiwan, Hong Kong and the PRC.

If one is clear that they are just talking about the Chinese commies is it just as racist?

Offline bachfiend

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Re: Episode #734
« Reply #25 on: August 05, 2019, 06:55:46 PM »
OK.  But false factoids shouldn’t make it into the show.

Here's to the endless pursuit of perfection.

Quote
It’s been shown that even if false factoids are mentioned, and then shown to be false, people (owing to the vagaries of memory) often tend to believe that the false factoids are actually true.

Indeed. All the more reason for us to continue using our skeptical antennae even when information comes from an otherwise trustworthy source.

Of course, there's actually a regular segment in the show which purposefully presents a fiction so be careful to guard against misremembering them as science. :-)

I stopped listening to the show after the episode with the SoF segment which presented as fact the assertion that Winston Churchill had bipolar disorder, which was definitely fiction.  Churchill had understandable situational despondency, as during his Wilderness Years, but he didn’t have bipolar disorder.

So this is an example of a fiction being presented as fact, despite it being researched to ensure accuracy.  If I didn’t know Churchill’s life story, I might have accepted it as fact.
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Offline daniel1948

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Re: Episode #734
« Reply #26 on: August 05, 2019, 07:17:46 PM »
Duplicate post.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2019, 07:33:51 PM by daniel1948 »
Daniel
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-- Otto von Bismarck

Offline daniel1948

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Re: Episode #734
« Reply #27 on: August 05, 2019, 07:16:28 PM »
Can I ask a meta question?

If godhead had said, "Chinese Communists" instead of just "chinese" would it still be racist?

He said Chinese culture.
Well then, if he had said, "Chinese Communist culture" instead? 

There does seem to be significant cultural differences between Taiwan, Hong Kong and the PRC.

If one is clear that they are just talking about the Chinese commies is it just as racist?

What does your question have to do with GodHead? He made an insensitive, offensive, and bigoted statement. Your question is entirely unrelated. I will say that not all bigotry is racist bigotry. One can be bigoted against a particular gender or against speakers of a particular language, or against people of a particular political party. None of those forms of bigotry are racist. But they are just as offensive, and just as wrong since all those groups are so diverse that nothing you can say about the character of the people in them would be valid.
Daniel
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"Anyone who has ever looked into the glazed eyes of a soldier dying on the battlefield will think long and hard before starting a war."
-- Otto von Bismarck

Offline lucek

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Re: Episode #734
« Reply #28 on: August 05, 2019, 08:57:10 PM »
Can I ask a meta question?

If godhead had said, "Chinese Communists" instead of just "chinese" would it still be racist?

He said Chinese culture.
Well then, if he had said, "Chinese Communist culture" instead? 

There does seem to be significant cultural differences between Taiwan, Hong Kong and the PRC.

If one is clear that they are just talking about the Chinese commies is it just as racist?

What does your question have to do with GodHead? He made an insensitive, offensive, and bigoted statement. Your question is entirely unrelated. I will say that not all bigotry is racist bigotry. One can be bigoted against a particular gender or against speakers of a particular language, or against people of a particular political party. None of those forms of bigotry are racist. But they are just as offensive, and just as wrong since all those groups are so diverse that nothing you can say about the character of the people in them would be valid.
Just a nitpick he's not exactly wrong. But from the same perspective pretty much every culture is based of lies and misstruths.
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Offline lucek

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Re: Episode #734
« Reply #29 on: August 05, 2019, 09:02:04 PM »
All factoids are false because they are factoids and not facts.
Not necessarily. Factoid as discussed on the show has evolved into meaning a small or minor fact but even in it's original definition it just meant a fact like statement. For example a tautology isn't a fact but phrased the right way it is a factoid but not false.
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Power is just energy over time and. . .
Energy is just the ability to do work.

 

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