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Do you agree with this prophecy?

yes
1 (5.9%)
no
5 (29.4%)
It is partially correct.
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I am not a Christian.
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Total Members Voted: 17

Author Topic: The Beast Revelation  (Read 1496 times)

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Offline Captain Video

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Re: The Beast Revelation
« Reply #45 on: February 20, 2020, 03:34:03 PM »
A lot of uneducated people imagine that The Bible is a fixed, universal thing in and of itself, not realizing that at various times and places different people assembled different lists of which scriptures their followers should read, and this list has changed, and still today the Catholic Bible is different than the Protestant one.

Holy Space Jesus.  I never knew this.  I had to look it up just now to make sure it was real.  I also just looked up the difference between the United Kingdom and Great Britian, which I also didn't know.

The Orthodox bible and Coptic Bibles also contain different books. But most of the differences deal with the Old Testament. Luther's Bible was a little different than many protestant Bibles because the thought that some books were lesser scripture such as James. The Catholics settled their canon at the Council of Trent in 382. You must remember that until the Protestants, Christians didn't view the Bible as the soul source of truth and the Bible was of far lesser importance.

Exactly! Martin Luther invented the idea that the Bible is the Sole Authority on Everything™. He was pissed at the Catholic Church (of which he was a priest) for being totally corrupt from top to bottom. (See the Decameron of Bocaccio for the flavor of the Church in its heyday.) But he couldn't claim himself to be a higher authority than the Pope. So he decided that scripture, rather than the Church, should be the authority. He was also a vicious anti-Semite.

And since it's the rare Christian who knows anything of the history of his own religion, people forget that for the first three-quarters of the history of Christianity, the Bible was considered dangerous for the uneducated, and the laity were forbidden to read it, assuming they could read, which most couldn't.

Growing up Lutheran there was not as much emphasis on the bible during worship as other denominations. No bibles were present among the pews.  We had a hymnal and lessons were taught out of that. My church was old fashioned as it used the older out of date "Red" hymnal and other Lutherans used the "green"

The sermon was from the bible but usually consisted of one or two small passages followed by an hour of boring explanation and conjecture.

We did have some bible study at "Sunday school" and I think during confirmation. When I fist visited another denomination I was surprised to find the Bibles in place of the hymnals. "where are all the songs?" How are we supposed to know what to sing and when?

When the "Born again Christians" recruited me they used the lack of bibles in the Lutheran church as one of the reasons to leave it. They hated Catholics even more. I wish the Christians would go back to hating each other, it was much more pleasant.


Offline daniel1948

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Re: The Beast Revelation
« Reply #46 on: February 20, 2020, 05:28:57 PM »
Interesting. I once let a friend talk me into visiting with his Missouri Synod Lutheran pastor. The guy was a Bible-thumping nut job, and a pro-war conservative Republican who displayed an American flag in his church. He gave me a free Bible. He offered me one of the modern versions and when I said I prefer the KJV he opened a different drawer and gave me one of those. He had drawers full of Bibles, apparently in all the popular translations.

OTOH, I met with the assistant to the bishop of the Eastern North Dakota division of the ELCA, a man actually named Charlie Brown, when I was a liaison from our local peace group, and he was very supportive of our peace work. I think the ELCA had Bibles in church, but I think they were not literalists. Not really sure, though. I did attend a Lutheran church one time during the period when I was going to churches to try to recruit for the anti-war movement, but all I remember is that it was a mega-church that was obviously not a place to find sympathy with our peace group.
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Offline seamas

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Re: The Beast Revelation
« Reply #47 on: February 20, 2020, 06:22:27 PM »
who displayed an American flag in his church.

An American flag is not a bit unusual in any house of worship in the USA.  My catholic church in the 70s was your typical post Vatican II liberal (for catholic anyway) type of place. It had at least one. Most of the Houses of worship I have been to were catholic or jewish and there would usually be some flag present. None of these places had much of a right wing bias.
Personally I don't like the idea of ceding the flag to conservatives. Their claim on it is tenuous and their respect for it (do-rags, clothing, letting it get tattered by the elements) is disgraceful.
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Offline arthwollipot

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Re: The Beast Revelation
« Reply #48 on: February 20, 2020, 06:33:10 PM »
The extent to which Americans love displaying their flag is frankly weird to us foreigners.
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Offline daniel1948

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Re: The Beast Revelation
« Reply #49 on: February 20, 2020, 08:10:04 PM »
who displayed an American flag in his church.

An American flag is not a bit unusual in any house of worship in the USA.  My catholic church in the 70s was your typical post Vatican II liberal (for catholic anyway) type of place. It had at least one. Most of the Houses of worship I have been to were catholic or jewish and there would usually be some flag present. None of these places had much of a right wing bias.
Personally I don't like the idea of ceding the flag to conservatives. Their claim on it is tenuous and their respect for it (do-rags, clothing, letting it get tattered by the elements) is disgraceful.

Christianity claims to be a universal religion. It claims to be open to all. The flag is the emblem of the nation, which is closed (or tries very hard to be closed) to all but citizens and a select few "approved" foreigners. National flags are anathema to any religion that claims to be universal.

The flag is actually intended to be an emblem used to designate the nationality of ships at sea and diplomatic vehicles, and to identify federal buildings and polling places. In the United States, like it or not it has also become an emblem of nationalism. It's a pretty good bet that somebody who flies an American flag is opposed to free speech and equal rights under the law. And it's a good bet that any priest, rabbi, or pastor who flies the American flag in their place of worship believes that God thinks that Americans are better than, and worth more than, the people of other nations.

The American flag is ugly and what it stands for stinks.
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Offline seamas

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Re: The Beast Revelation
« Reply #50 on: February 21, 2020, 11:24:53 AM »
Christianity claims to be a universal religion.

So?


It claims to be open to all.

And?

National flags are anathema to any religion that claims to be universal.

Sounds like yet another one of your pet peeves where you confuse your own personal biases into some universal truth. You have an active dislike for both religion and for nations. I get it. But what you cannot do is thrust your personal prejudice into the mind and hearts of other people. You don't get to decide what THEIR values are.
The religion can easily transcend borders without ignoring nations.

It's a pretty good bet that somebody who flies an American flag is opposed to free speech and equal rights under the law.
You would lose that bet.

And it's a good bet that any priest, rabbi, or pastor who flies the American flag in their place of worship believes that God thinks that Americans are better than, and worth more than, the people of other nations.

You really are crappy at making bets.

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Offline Edge of Sanity

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Re: The Beast Revelation
« Reply #51 on: February 21, 2020, 12:53:43 PM »
Religion is just an excuse for having to die no matter what religion you practice......
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Offline Captain Video

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Re: The Beast Revelation
« Reply #52 on: February 21, 2020, 01:41:40 PM »
The extent to which Americans love displaying their flag is frankly weird to us foreigners.

I understand.

The concept of having a Queen and even placing her on money is frankly weird to us foreigners.   >:D

Not to mention having that same monarch in charge of your church (which I am guessing is not the case where you live)

Who needs a flag when you have got a Queen or King to display.






Offline Captain Video

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Re: The Beast Revelation
« Reply #53 on: February 21, 2020, 02:12:27 PM »
edit

wrong thread






Offline Tassie Dave

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Re: The Beast Revelation
« Reply #54 on: February 21, 2020, 04:35:24 PM »
The extent to which Americans love displaying their flag is frankly weird to us foreigners.

I understand.

The concept of having a Queen and even placing her on money is frankly weird to us foreigners.   >:D

Not to mention having that same monarch in charge of your church (which I am guessing is not the case where you live)

Who needs a flag when you have got a Queen or King to display.

Only 13% of Aussies are Anglican. Half of us want to get rid of the monarchy and have a President. Which will happen eventually.

It is ridiculous that we've been an independent country for 120 years, yet still have a foreigner as our Head of State  :-\

Offline Edge of Sanity

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Re: The Beast Revelation
« Reply #55 on: February 21, 2020, 05:19:42 PM »
The extent to which Americans love displaying their flag is frankly weird to us foreigners.

I understand.

The concept of having a Queen and even placing her on money is frankly weird to us foreigners.   >:D

Not to mention having that same monarch in charge of your church (which I am guessing is not the case where you live)

Who needs a flag when you have got a Queen or King to display.

You would have to understand the history behind the US flag...Maybe the below link will help.

https://www.ushistory.org/betsy/flagfact.html
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Offline John Albert

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Re: The Beast Revelation
« Reply #56 on: February 21, 2020, 06:50:31 PM »
Betsy Ross LOL

Offline Edge of Sanity

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Re: The Beast Revelation
« Reply #57 on: February 22, 2020, 04:53:09 PM »
It was not just Ross....I will let it go at that. >:(
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Offline Tassie Dave

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Re: The Beast Revelation
« Reply #58 on: February 22, 2020, 07:30:07 PM »
Just because it has history, (not including the Betsy Ross myth), isn't an excuse to fetishise the flag. That does seem to be a uniquely American thing, among some groups.

These same groups do seem to treat any misuse of their flag i.e burning it, wiping your arse with it  ;) as a major crime.
To me these are legitimate forms of protest. I, personally, wouldn't do it, but I can understand it being done as a protest against whatever country the flag represents.

Offline daniel1948

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Re: The Beast Revelation
« Reply #59 on: February 22, 2020, 07:38:46 PM »
I am opposed to burning the flag and all other garbage because it causes air pollution.
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