Skeptics Guide to the Universe Forums

The Skeptics' Guide to the Universe => Podcast Episodes => Topic started by: Steven Novella on February 24, 2018, 12:06:53 PM

Title: Episode #659
Post by: Steven Novella on February 24, 2018, 12:06:53 PM
Forgotten Superheroes of Science: Oscar Micheaux; News Items: Satellite Broadband, Superbrain Yoga, Video Game Violence; Who's That Noisy; Name That Logical Fallacy; Your Questions and E-mails: Cellulose and the Analemma; Science or Fiction
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: DevoutCatalyst on February 24, 2018, 12:07:27 PM
The washing machine saga continues...
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: grayson on February 24, 2018, 12:56:18 PM
I recently became a damned dirty ape. Question, does it always take longer for the ad-free version to be released? So far, I just end up listening to the regular version. I'm a member because I want to support the SGU, so I don't care about the ads that much, ad-free just doesn't feel like much of a perk so far.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: Belgarath on February 24, 2018, 12:57:40 PM
I recently became a damned dirty ape. Question, does it always take longer for the ad-free version to be released? So far, I just end up listening to the regular version. I'm a member because I want to support the SGU, so I don't care about the ads that much, ad-free just doesn't feel like much of a perk so far.

It almost always comes out at exactly the same time.

Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: grayson on February 24, 2018, 01:00:37 PM
Thanks for the reply. Sounds good. Could be my pocket casts app too. Not a problem. I don't mind the ads, just curious.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: DevoutCatalyst on February 24, 2018, 01:02:02 PM
Thanks for the reply. Sounds good. Could be my pocket casts app too. Not a problem. I don't mind the ads, just curious.
Must be because it was there before this thread began.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: JohnM on February 25, 2018, 07:21:11 AM

I love Elon Musk as much as next nerd but I would just love to see some ounce of skeptical thought when he's been discussed. This starlink sounds awesome and it will help a lot of people no doubt but the idea it's going to bring internet to poor people around the world?

That to me just sounded like a huge claim so I checked wiki and you can "install easily at end-user premises for approximately US$200" well that's about the bottom 20% of people out straight away regardless of any subscription cost.

Again I think Musk is one of the good guys but the way he's talked about on this podcast it's like the second coming of Jesus.

Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: DevoutCatalyst on February 25, 2018, 07:35:42 AM

I love Elon Musk as much as next nerd but I would just love to see some ounce of skeptical thought when he's been discussed. This starlink sounds awesome and it will help a lot of people no doubt but the idea it's going to bring internet to poor people around the world?

That to me just sounded like a huge claim so I checked wiki and you can "install easily at end-user premises for approximately US$200" well that's about the bottom 20% of people out straight away regardless of any subscription cost.

Again I think Musk is one of the good guys but the way he's talked about on this podcast it's like the second coming of Jesus.

Was that Bob? Bob speaks enthusiastically in florid tones about everything tech. Bob was a game changer in a previous life.

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/14/Microsoft_Bob.PNG)
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: zeldamcmuffin on February 25, 2018, 10:12:05 AM
Great episode, as always! I especially enjoyed the shout-out to Oscar Micheaux. Didn't know much about him until the library I work for renovated my home branch and named the new A/V lab in his honor. In fact, every room in the branch honors a STEM pioneer. I still get warm fuzzies when people ask to book a meeting in the Carl Sagan conference room =)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/bkUMEaKfzob79FInYMRrwbqpZp70kbd2yPeg7HItXC8B1EOlHu22V8khPoRjltKUS3hnxIBpJxZRWJpfIWhngFAsVWuQsDTpZcnEOqpBVTS3mojY4xIOMmj8qfCK5B0OBfjc5CGWqm_tBX4mGRWVP3K_5bNruW6kffNmur3sCgvzUbmah9wEGO6DYLQSkmX1h0h3oyRRc7pxXIYJ0akSH8WF8PY9XMDSWB7rITY5B8Ux6y49cQ2wOJZAtz6eTFKwjc5LA9yNP4-Jo7YiFrdvf1T8r4b_AOt539NFWUtN6th_aLiM1FpCJ3Z69NGHI9rpk_RENOHIMgbPCKa5C_pgy8omy0L5dd0PZ2iGKpb_SrgJq6g-xG3uxu7eEkGj8MdM7-dtA9R-xnwCiobRhKEvNPLSY1cMV7FvkFfIbZpbSVMHuGeWak7n4thDhof79LRl4_WKq2WF0f---KF8VEpmzc7DuObRfJ_toLEo6jEN6CC_kRDE5m0QGK4r6y28LmSMTRyR5dNCtI1AZHtgOqAl8hz2XEYus6cmkLley1x9f6GX_7kPltjjJzWRWdbOcuvCd5KEp3Ohgymdc0SderqA8iXYHJTG6yNiuXZ4h08=w1501-h693-no)
https://hclibrary.org/locations/savage-branch/savage-branch-stem-education-center-classrooms (https://hclibrary.org/locations/savage-branch/savage-branch-stem-education-center-classrooms)
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: daniel1948 on February 25, 2018, 01:57:00 PM
I recently became a damned dirty ape. Question, does it always take longer for the ad-free version to be released? So far, I just end up listening to the regular version. I'm a member because I want to support the SGU, so I don't care about the ads that much, ad-free just doesn't feel like much of a perk so far.

You also get some premium content as a member. Sometimes I find the premium content uninteresting. Sometimes I really enjoy it.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: daniel1948 on February 25, 2018, 01:59:51 PM
O got SoF right! Yea!!! Hardly ever happens.

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: daniel1948 on February 25, 2018, 02:07:29 PM
On violent video games, I'm surprised, and a bit disappointed, that they did not mention the elephant in the room: The hue and cry against violent video games with reference to shootings, is a clear and baldfaced attempt to distract from the real issue: Guns and their much-too-easy availability. Don't have to talk about guns if the real issue is that violent video games are the real problem.

"Guns don't kill people. People kill people." But people with guns are able to kill a lot more people, a lot more easily, than people with knives. Let a maniac with a knife loose in a crowd and he might stab a few, and maybe, just maybe, one or two of those will die, but most will survive, and the crowd will stop him in short order. If he has a gun, he can kill dozens before anyone can even figure out where he is. Arm the whole crowd and ten times as many people die as the crowd starts shooting in every direction to try to stop the maniac. Give a drunk a knife when he's angry at his wife, and she has a good chance of getting away. Give him a gun and her chances just dropped to slim.

ETA: I don't even like video games. I don't play them and have no interest in them. But even I can see that they're being used as a diversion to distract the conversation from the real issue.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: daniel1948 on February 25, 2018, 02:33:42 PM
Elon Musk is a brilliant entrepreneur. I've been driving one of his cars for 6 1/2 years and it's the best and most fun car I've ever had. And now I'm about to trade off to the latest of his cars, because of the cool tech driver-assist features. What he's done with SpaceX is awe-inspiring. Solar City, now absorbed into Tesla, is also amazing.

But...

He is an incurable chrono-optimist. Tesla has never yet brought out a car on schedule. The cars are brilliant and marvelous and the safest on the road. But they come out long after they were first promised. I have no doubt he will make Starlink happen, but I guarantee you it will not happen on time. As for "everyone in the world," obviously there are costs. It will be available everywhere in the world, to anyone who can afford the price.

On the subject of jetpacks for fun, that Cara said she wants:

I doubt if there will ever be a consumer jetpack for travel. But if you just want to fly around for fun, there is a water-jetpack that lets you fly around over water, with a hose extending down to suck up the water. You can go as high as the length of the hose. You will NEVER get me into one of those, because it looks fucking dangerous. But if you are into adrenalin sports requiring a high level of skill and carrying a significant risk of injury or death, you can do it.

https://youtu.be/aiE58Ri5axQ

This one is powered by a jetski. They claim it's safe and "guarantee" you'll be flying after 5 minutes. No, I'm still not going to try to do it: (Well maybe I'd try it if I really thought I could get one of the girls in the video. ;D )

https://youtu.be/m4Bm3cs9TFo
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: PabloHoney on February 25, 2018, 03:03:51 PM
Now I'm hungry for meatleg.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: werecow on February 25, 2018, 07:10:56 PM
Either Muse has changed significantly since I last listened to them (which admittedly is a while ago), or Steve is an old man for referring to them as "kind of heavy metal". }|;oP
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: lonely moa on February 26, 2018, 03:19:24 AM
The amount of water used per unit of food is laughable, really.  A rough calculation tells me that my cattle rate about 150L/Kg of edible meat and my guess is that my soil microbes are doing a great nob of sequestering more carbon than the cattle exhale.  Not sure of what amount of water/Kg of beef Cara said but I assume she only parroted something she read. 

I didn't hear the amount of water per unit of rice was (or the amount of methane produced).
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: daniel1948 on February 26, 2018, 08:20:13 AM
The amount of water used per unit of food is laughable, really.  A rough calculation tells me that my cattle rate about 150L/Kg of edible meat and my guess is that my soil microbes are doing a great nob of sequestering more carbon than the cattle exhale.  Not sure of what amount of water/Kg of beef Cara said but I assume she only parroted something she read. 

I didn't hear the amount of water per unit of rice was (or the amount of methane produced).

I think your cattle are entirely pasture raised. This is not the case for meat available in grocery stores. And it's not just the water the animals drink. It's also the water used to raise the food they eat. In your case that would be (I presume) the rain on your pasture. In the case of commercial meat that's the water used to raise all the hay they eat and all the grain they eat. And since cows are about 10% efficient at turning plant matter into meat, the cows are using ten times as much water as it would take to feed the same number of people on plants, plus the water the cows drink.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: Swagomatic on February 26, 2018, 12:53:24 PM
Is anyone else having trouble with getting the podcast this week?  I tried to listen in Pocket Casts, and no dice.  Next, I went to the website directly, again, no dice.  Last ditch, I tried i-tunes, and it still would not work.  I'm flummoxed.

ETA:  I was able to download it to my Pocket Casts app on my phone, so I have it now, but I still can't access the premium feed.  ???
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: lonely moa on February 26, 2018, 12:53:39 PM
The amount of water used per unit of food is laughable, really.  A rough calculation tells me that my cattle rate about 150L/Kg of edible meat and my guess is that my soil microbes are doing a great nob of sequestering more carbon than the cattle exhale.  Not sure of what amount of water/Kg of beef Cara said but I assume she only parroted something she read. 

I didn't hear the amount of water per unit of rice was (or the amount of methane produced).

I think your cattle are entirely pasture raised. This is not the case for meat available in grocery stores. And it's not just the water the animals drink. It's also the water used to raise the food they eat. In your case that would be (I presume) the rain on your pasture. In the case of commercial meat that's the water used to raise all the hay they eat and all the grain they eat. And since cows are about 10% efficient at turning plant matter into meat, the cows are using ten times as much water as it would take to feed the same number of people on plants, plus the water the cows drink.

In America... There are no feed lots in NZ.  All the  213,402 tonnes of meat (about NZ $1.5 billion) sent to the USA is raised similarly to my yearly two dozen animals.  I reckon you don't think this is a 'commercial" amount of beef. 
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: werecow on February 26, 2018, 12:59:37 PM
Is anyone else having trouble with getting the podcast this week?  I tried to listen in Pocket Casts, and no dice.  Next, I went to the website directly, again, no dice.  Last ditch, I tried i-tunes, and it still would not work.  I'm flummoxed.

I got it from here (http://media.libsyn.com/media/skepticsguide/skepticast2018-02-24.mp3) without any trouble.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: Swagomatic on February 26, 2018, 01:20:54 PM
Is anyone else having trouble with getting the podcast this week?  I tried to listen in Pocket Casts, and no dice.  Next, I went to the website directly, again, no dice.  Last ditch, I tried i-tunes, and it still would not work.  I'm flummoxed.

I got it from here (http://media.libsyn.com/media/skepticsguide/skepticast2018-02-24.mp3) without any trouble.

I just rebooted my system, and now it's all good.    Just a weird glitch, I guess - now everything works.  I should have tried that from the git-go.
Thanks
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: daniel1948 on February 26, 2018, 07:10:04 PM
The amount of water used per unit of food is laughable, really.  A rough calculation tells me that my cattle rate about 150L/Kg of edible meat and my guess is that my soil microbes are doing a great nob of sequestering more carbon than the cattle exhale.  Not sure of what amount of water/Kg of beef Cara said but I assume she only parroted something she read. 

I didn't hear the amount of water per unit of rice was (or the amount of methane produced).

I think your cattle are entirely pasture raised. This is not the case for meat available in grocery stores. And it's not just the water the animals drink. It's also the water used to raise the food they eat. In your case that would be (I presume) the rain on your pasture. In the case of commercial meat that's the water used to raise all the hay they eat and all the grain they eat. And since cows are about 10% efficient at turning plant matter into meat, the cows are using ten times as much water as it would take to feed the same number of people on plants, plus the water the cows drink.

In America... There are no feed lots in NZ.  All the  213,402 tonnes of meat (about NZ $1.5 billion) sent to the USA is raised similarly to my yearly two dozen animals.  I reckon you don't think this is a 'commercial" amount of beef. 

As you say, New Zealand exports about 613,000,000 pounds of beef to the U.S. per year. The U.S. consumes about 24,000,000,000 pounds of beef per year. So New Zealand beef amounts to about 2.5% of U.S. beef consumption. A drop in the bucket if we're looking at overall production and total water use.

And here's an article about a feed lot in New Zealand that doubles the weight of cows by feeding them grain for 250 days. This particular feed lot produces for the Japanese market, but there's at least one feed lot in NZ:

https://teara.govt.nz/en/photograph/17350/five-star-feed-lot

And here's the article from the Guardian, quoting the Institution of Mechanical Engineers on water use for various foods, and also talking about food waste: (I think it unlikely that the IME published this without doing a thorough analysis.)

https://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2013/jan/10/how-much-water-food-production-waste
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: lucek on February 26, 2018, 09:29:12 PM
The amount of water used per unit of food is laughable, really.  A rough calculation tells me that my cattle rate about 150L/Kg of edible meat and my guess is that my soil microbes are doing a great nob of sequestering more carbon than the cattle exhale.  Not sure of what amount of water/Kg of beef Cara said but I assume she only parroted something she read. 

I didn't hear the amount of water per unit of rice was (or the amount of methane produced).
Rice is grown in patties. Patties that are flooded. I imagine cranberries are high on the water ratio for the same reason.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: lonely moa on February 27, 2018, 03:01:20 AM


And here's an article about a feed lot in New Zealand that doubles the weight of cows by feeding them grain for 250 days. This particular feed lot produces for the Japanese market, but there's at least one feed lot in NZ:



You're correct. The Five Star feed lot in Ashburton (Ash Vegas, we call it, and only 30 k's from our farm) grows Kobe beef for a strictly Japanese market.  The cattle are not only strictly bred for the purpose, but are taken for walks, fed beer and listen to music.  Not your standard feedlot.  They might even wipe the steers arses.

Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: Bessantj on February 27, 2018, 06:22:49 AM
Cool of you to take your daughter to the metal concert :evan:. I do like a good metal concert you can really let loose in the pit. Though these days getting close to forty I'm more likely to be standing towards the back with a pint in my hand.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: werecow on February 27, 2018, 06:37:56 AM
I think Steve's right that the logical fallacy discussed on this week's show is a subcategory of hasty generalization, but it's more specific, and it's common enough that maybe it should get it's own name. Maybe it should be named something along the lines of "hasty extrapolation"?
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: Fast Eddie B on February 27, 2018, 07:36:33 AM
“Hasty Generalization” is what popped into my mind.

But if one is arguing based on a misunderstanding of how the physical world works, is that really fallacious reasoning?

For example, one would do better to explain how the effect of drug doses actually work, addressing not the logic of the argument but the factual basis of it.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: daniel1948 on February 27, 2018, 08:36:01 AM


And here's an article about a feed lot in New Zealand that doubles the weight of cows by feeding them grain for 250 days. This particular feed lot produces for the Japanese market, but there's at least one feed lot in NZ:



You're correct. The Five Star feed lot in Ashburton (Ash Vegas, we call it, and only 30 k's from our farm) grows Kobe beef for a strictly Japanese market.  The cattle are not only strictly bred for the purpose, but are taken for walks, fed beer and listen to music.  Not your standard feedlot.  They might even wipe the steers arses.

Beer? No wonder they claim the cows are happy. ;D

Cool of you to take your daughter to the metal concert :evan:. I do like a good metal concert you can really let loose in the pit. Though these days getting close to forty I'm more likely to be standing towards the back with a pint in my hand.

I'm not much of a concert goer, but I had a really great time when my mother and I went to a concert in London. Quite by accident, walking around town, we stumbled upon St. Martin in the Fields (one of the most famous concert halls in the world, and justifiably so, as the sound was superb) and went to a concert there. I think it might have been something by Handel.

I'll let you young whippersnappers go to the concerts where people scream and get crushed.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: werecow on February 27, 2018, 11:42:08 AM
“Hasty Generalization” is what popped into my mind.

But if one is arguing based on a misunderstanding of how the physical world works, is that really fallacious reasoning?

For example, one would do better to explain how the effect of drug doses actually work, addressing not the logic of the argument but the factual basis of it.

Well, extrapolating a linear regression trend to unknown extremes from a model based on less extreme data points, for example, can be considered a statistical fallacy. The idea is that, while the linear relationship might hold locally for the points you have examined and any that lie close by, it may ultimately be an inadequate model when you look at extreme examples that are outside your experience.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: Alex Simmons on February 27, 2018, 03:28:16 PM
“Hasty Generalization” is what popped into my mind.

But if one is arguing based on a misunderstanding of how the physical world works, is that really fallacious reasoning?

For example, one would do better to explain how the effect of drug doses actually work, addressing not the logic of the argument but the factual basis of it.

Well, extrapolating a linear regression trend to unknown extremes from a model based on less extreme data points, for example, can be considered a statistical fallacy. The idea is that, while the linear relationship might hold locally for the points you have examined and any that lie close by, it may ultimately be an inadequate model when you look at extreme examples that are outside your experience.
For models it's important to recognise their domain of validity. Once you stray outside that, all bets are off.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: God Bomb on February 27, 2018, 07:33:01 PM
This week's science or fiction was interesting for the most part, but again Steve failed to mention that water has the annoying tendency to flow downhill.

Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: DevoutCatalyst on February 27, 2018, 07:51:30 PM
This week's science or fiction was interesting for the most part, but again Steve failed to mention that water has the annoying tendency to flow downhill.
At the beginning he gave a pretty good summary of the water flowing downhill damage to his house.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: stands2reason on February 27, 2018, 08:48:41 PM
"5G-like speed" is open to interpretation. For example, gigabit LTE infrastructure is currently in the process of being rolled out by various US cell phone companies. But I think Evan got the gist right, which is that "5G equivalent" means gigabit. Even "regular" 4G LTE typically supports 50 megabits per second upload, and BTW that is the minimum upload speed required for the 5G spec.

What they got wrong, however, is that they started talking about Starlink as thought it is a satellite phone company, just based on reporting of "5G equivalent speed", which is not the same thing as providing 5G via satellite. I think satellite phones are a cool idea and would like to see more providers, but 5G cannot travel 700 miles, and could definitely not deliver that kind of bandwidth to a mobile device.

https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2017/02/5g-imt-2020-specs/
https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2018/02/spacexs-satellite-broadband-nears-fcc-approval-and-first-test-launch/

That to me just sounded like a huge claim so I checked wiki and you can "install easily at end-user premises for approximately US$200" well that's about the bottom 20% of people out straight away regardless of any subscription cost.

Even in developing countries, it will still be used for commercial and municipal use. The US definition of broadband is now 25 mbps. A local company or government could get a gigabit connection and provide "broadband" to dozens of people (or maybe a hundred at once, depending on actual use patterns).

Although the satellites will not directly be usable by cell phones, the satellite connection could also be used as infrastructure/backbone (as opposed to fiber), making it much more economical to install new cell towers.

I am curious how much spectrum SpaceX owns and how much data can actually be transmitted. Based on the large number of satellites, I expect they are using highly directional antennas, so one would multiple the amount of radio bandwidth they own by a thousand or several...
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: stands2reason on February 27, 2018, 08:57:54 PM
On violent video games, I'm surprised, and a bit disappointed, that they did not mention the elephant in the room: The hue and cry against violent video games with reference to shootings, is a clear and baldfaced attempt to distract from the real issue: Guns and their much-too-easy availability. Don't have to talk about guns if the real issue is that violent video games are the real problem.

Big surprise that the only country where guns per capita is nearly 1:1 is virtually the only place where shootings are regular; we might be surprised that shootings aren't orders of magnitude more common than they are.

The first first-person shooter with 3D polygon-mesh graphics (i.e. modern 3D game) was actually developed by a Japanese company in 1994. (https://www.giantbomb.com/geograph-seal/3030-41606/)
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: Here2 on February 27, 2018, 09:44:18 PM
Surprised they didn't talk about water being a polar molecule  -- I thought that was how Steve was trying to trip them up


Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: Here2 on February 27, 2018, 09:47:56 PM

I love Elon Musk as much as next nerd but I would just love to see some ounce of skeptical thought when he's been discussed. This starlink sounds awesome and it will help a lot of people no doubt but the idea it's going to bring internet to poor people around the world?

...

Again I think Musk is one of the good guys but the way he's talked about on this podcast it's like the second coming of Jesus.
Glad I'm not the only one that thinks they're crushin' too hard over Elon
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: God Bomb on February 28, 2018, 03:04:34 AM
Maybe vocal support of Elon will encourage other ridiculously rich people to take on similar projects.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: RMoore on February 28, 2018, 12:29:18 PM
“Hasty Generalization” is what popped into my mind.

But if one is arguing based on a misunderstanding of how the physical world works, is that really fallacious reasoning?

For example, one would do better to explain how the effect of drug doses actually work, addressing not the logic of the argument but the factual basis of it.

If you are talking about formal fallacies, then having faulty premises is not a fallacy. Your argument may be valid, but it won't be sound.

But hasty generalization is an informal fallacy.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: Jeremy's Sea on February 28, 2018, 01:48:56 PM

I love Elon Musk as much as next nerd but I would just love to see some ounce of skeptical thought when he's been discussed. This starlink sounds awesome and it will help a lot of people no doubt but the idea it's going to bring internet to poor people around the world?

...

Again I think Musk is one of the good guys but the way he's talked about on this podcast it's like the second coming of Jesus.
Glad I'm not the only one that thinks they're crushin' too hard over Elon
Yeah it's so annoying to hear my brother blather on about how Phish is the best band ever... it's just unnatural to hero worship people you respect.  :P
Jay is the most hyperbolic person, ever. I'd say take his hero worship with a grain of salt.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: Skepmic on February 28, 2018, 03:16:01 PM
What makes Oscar Micheaux a FSOS? I didn't quite get it while listening and after giving his Wikipedia page a read I still don't. He seems like a cultural figure.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: Harry Black on February 28, 2018, 07:48:41 PM

I love Elon Musk as much as next nerd but I would just love to see some ounce of skeptical thought when he's been discussed. This starlink sounds awesome and it will help a lot of people no doubt but the idea it's going to bring internet to poor people around the world?

...

Again I think Musk is one of the good guys but the way he's talked about on this podcast it's like the second coming of Jesus.
Glad I'm not the only one that thinks they're crushin' too hard over Elon
Yeah it's so annoying to hear my brother blather on about how Phish is the best band ever... it's just unnatural to hero worship people you respect.  :P
Jay is the most hyperbolic person, ever. I'd say take his hero worship with a grain of salt.
I dont think its all hyperbole. Jay does not seem to apply critical thought to anything Musk does.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: DevoutCatalyst on March 01, 2018, 08:38:16 AM
So is Jay the one who gushes over new technology? I thought it was Bob. The nepotism has me confused.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: daniel1948 on March 01, 2018, 09:05:16 AM
I can't tell them apart (except Steven and Cara, and formerly Rebecca). One of them does seem emotionally extreme. Everything is so absolutely wonderful, fabulous, marvelous, whether it's a movie or a new finding, and every new discovery is going to completely transform the world. E.g., driverless car technology was going to lead to self-driving hotel rooms that would detach from the hotel and pick you up at the airport. Say WHAT?!?!?!?!? Driverless car technology was going to lead to buildings that come apart, drive around, and re-assemble themselves??? My first thought was "What's he been smoking?" If detachable, drivable hotel rooms were remotely feasible, we could have them now. It's not like there's any shortage of people to drive them.

But I guess it's just his uncritical ebullience. That's probably better than being a sourpuss like me. I really need to move to Maui. I'm never sour when I'm in a kayak on the water. My kayak guides (and my hiking guides) all think that I am always cheerful.

Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: 2397 on March 01, 2018, 11:23:42 AM
Sorted by tech gushing; Bob, Jay, Cara, Evan, Steve.

Sorted by tushing; Bob, Steve, Jay, Cara, Evan.

Descending order.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: Jeremy's Sea on March 01, 2018, 01:32:04 PM
Sorted by tech gushing; Bob, Jay, Cara, Evan, Steve.

Sorted by tushing; Bob, Steve, Jay, Cara, Evan.

Descending order.
Pop culture gushing Jay definitely takes the first place. I love his enthusiasm, I wish I had more of it. I get why it bugs people as it sounds uncritical, but Jay is also good at revising his stance and admitting when he hangs on too long because he wants to believe.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: arthwollipot on March 01, 2018, 02:15:56 PM
What makes Oscar Micheaux a FSOS? I didn't quite get it while listening and after giving his Wikipedia page a read I still don't. He seems like a cultural figure.
They've broadened the definition over the years. Some of them haven't been "forgotten", someone of them haven't been "science", and forgive me for mentioning that none of them have been an actual "superhero".

But it's still an interesting segment regardless.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: RMoore on March 02, 2018, 05:44:38 PM
...none of them have been an actual "superhero".

How pendantic of you!
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: Harry Black on March 03, 2018, 01:46:49 PM
Ive rarely heard of the subjects so they must be somewhat forgotten by the public at large.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: GodSlayer on March 04, 2018, 12:07:01 AM
does anyone have a working 2018 SGU RSS feed? my old feed is still stuck in 2017
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: 2397 on March 04, 2018, 03:39:35 AM
https://feed.theskepticsguide.org/feed/rss.aspx

That one lists up to the latest one for me.
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: GodSlayer on March 04, 2018, 05:22:06 AM
https://feed.theskepticsguide.org/feed/rss.aspx

That one lists up to the latest one for me.

thanks. no luck using it in Feedreader, but uTorrent seems happy with it :)
Title: Re: Episode #659
Post by: MTBox on March 04, 2018, 01:33:55 PM
I need them not to have the "s" and this is working for my devices:
http://www.theskepticsguide.org/podcast/sgu