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TV & Movies / Re: Rate the last movie you just saw.
« Last post by Eternally Learning on Today at 04:44:33 AM »
Anna - 4/10

This movie was a complete mess.  The story had some potential despite not being very original, but they played it super safe and the editing decisions were truly baffling.  Literally about five or six times during the movie they do something that's supposed to shockingly subvert the viewers expectations and then cut to a screen saying "x months earlier."  If the twists were more clever it might have worked a bit better, but more than anything it just confuses the narrative and completely caused me to just not care any more.  It also would have helped to better establish the central character so that we could identify with her better but that too was sacrificed on the altar of trying to surprise the viewer every 10 minutes. 

For example, the opening of the film starts with a montage of several CIA agents being captured and killed by the KGB in 1985.  It then cuts to 1990 with Anna being recruited in a Moscow market by a modelling agent who then ships her off to Paris where she starts modelling.  Then she catches the eye of a wealthy man who she starts to date, then kills.  Then it cuts to a sequence of her living with an abusive boyfriend who robs an ATM which ends with her being recruited by a KGB agent.  Eventually she gets trained and employed as a full KGB agent leading to her being placed in the market with the KGB manipulating the modelling agent to find her.  Nowhere in this whole thing, besides a couple quick flashes and throwaway lines, do we learn who Anna is or what she really wants and with every shift in time it becomes less clear when the movie wants us to think it's clever or when it's just being sloppy.

To complicate matters even more, they've thrown a bunch of seemingly extraneous elements into the story as well that don't add anything to the story or characters and just serve to confuse everything else.  Anna's model girlfriend especially adds nothing and never made any sense in the story either.  They play it off like it's either part of her job or a refuge for her from her job, but then never really explain if it was either because she never seems to care about her and she never serves a purpose.  Beyond all that, this movie bizarrely got almost all of the technology laughably wrong for the setting.  Most of the tech belongs solidly in the early 2000s to the point where the head of the KGB uses a laptop with a 720p screen and USB drive as his primary computer in his KGB headquarters' office.  All of the stupidity of the writing and editing could be overlooked if the action was good but even here it flounders with only two all out action scenes and only one being anything approaching enjoyable.  I know this movie wasn't aiming to break new ground or anything but just once I wish a movie would be less lazy when choreographing action for female bad ass type characters with the bodies of supermodels. 

TL;DR, this movie is not worth your time.  I found little to no redeemable features save for one or two action scenes and even those were nothing special.  All the "twists and turns" just served to make me more annoyed with the movie and the main character is too bland and undefined to empathize with as a protagonist.
If the goal is to have a productive exchange of ideas, I think PsyStat could be thinking of this all wrong. The best way to handle a complicated human interaction is to treat it as one, and not try to formulate your conversational strategy using abstract analysis. Just have a natural conversation. Get to know the person and their values. If you are deciding how to talk to someone using acronyms or variable names ("X"), then you are probably overthinking things just a tad.
I'm trying to cover some of Johns points and questions, the science he put forth on the differences between the standard juice and nic salts Juul product would seem correct but I dont understand how you would not see they are different, the link from the american cancer society claimed they are more addictive and in my own experience I can assure you they are extremely powerful and can make you dizzy much like a non smoker smoking an unfiltered cig for the first time. The Juul also makes me cough.  It may be a better alternative for heavy smokers who are just starting to quit.

If vaping is indeed less harmful than smoking, then why should Juul be restricted from sale in convenience stores, while the more harmful cigarettes are still allowed?

Thats a good question, I don't know, it seems stupid to me, cigarettes are still more popular and deadly, Obama banned all flavors which were probably less than 2% of the market but didn't ban menthol which was is the most popular above regular, why? The big tobacco lobby probably, the same lobby that wants these flavored vape juices out of the public hands.

Are you asking me personally if we should ban sales of cigarettes in convince stores and only sell them in designated places? Not to mention Cigars, dip, and pipe tobacco. Yes, this is a public health issue and while I believe adults should be able to choose there is no reason why putting them in a place where children can not enter would hinder them being able to purchase them. Ill vote for that.

edit: let me amend that and say I would vote against any so called "blue laws" like the liqueur stores are subjected too or laws that declare what time those stores would be permitted to be open. No stopping sales on Sunday or after last call, if a tobacco shop wants to be open there is no legitimate reason they cant be open 24 hours. I'm ok with them being required to hire a cop like some liquor stores and medical marijuana faculties must do depending on the state. A few of our liquor stores here hire off duty cops of their own accord, its safer for them.

That looks exactly like the kind of thing you would find in the candy aisle of 7-11.

Yes absolutely, Adults purchase more of that 7-11 candy for themselves than they do for kids. That box is especially appealing and because of that I found a flavor I really like among all the other colored boxes which keep me from smoking. The PA dutch Hex symbol on the funnel cake caught my attention too as did the dunkin doughnut looking label and the circus looking cotton candy.  The store brand can not always afford that labeling and theirs are often white label or only include the stores logo. The bigger companies (not big tobacco) who do make those labels are much more like craft brewers and small wine makers.

Its the same candy store design with pot leaves and deadhead skulls on THC products marketed to adults. You usually will not and should not find those flavored NIC, THC, and CBD products being sold in places where kids are present.  The black market as I brought up before is another subject.

CBD is another big concern, Now we can add lots of woo into the mix and those products also come in flavors with candy store marketing but should we deny my mother and other adults medical CBD and THC with appealing flavors? I dont think this new flavor vape ban even covers that stuff. It wont stop the black market stuff the kids are doing.

If your problem is with capitalism and marketing that could be applied to all products not just vaping.
Went ski touring with a couple of young bucks (50).  Wx was perfect, snow was good, views were forever and the company as good as it gets.  But I am shattered.  But happy.
They are drug cartels, and they are selling the most addictive and lethal drug there is, and in spite of laws, they're selling it to kids.

This is the other point I'm trying to make that I think is important. Right now drug cartels are making black market THC products that work in a similar fashion to vaping and selling them to kids. The kids are also adding THC to regular Vape juice which does not work the same but may still produce a high. The oils can be heated to an incorrect temperature.  The kids are getting sick and some are dying. The products tested from the sick kids contains vitamin E acetate which is unusual and not in legitimate medical and recreational products. 90% of the sick KIDS admitted to THC use. CBD is also used by the kids. Quite a bit of what all kids get is black market because they are kids. Its easy to make. This is their version of smoking joints like our generations did or blunts like the 90s generation still does. The black market stuff has the same "candy store" and themed appearance that the vape stores and recreational and medical THC stores have (all of the THC products in the facilities have similar marketing). The kids can't actually know what chemicals they are breathing, statistically some are probably lying about the THC.

this is what the general public sees

The media:
Vaping is killing these kids!

The CDC:
90% is not enough we are not 100% sure what this is but we are sure it has to do with the vaping epidemic

Our President:
Flavors are killing kids right now, I'm going to ban all flavors and stop this epidemic

I believe the points put together in the blog I posted by the Doctor above whos credentials seem solid that we can be skeptical of the idea that the CDC does not have enough data pointing to vitamin E acetate and that Vaping is a completely separate issue to this current problem that is killing people.

Nobody is saying that these flavors are not attractive to kids, flavors are attractive to everyone, we are saying they are not marketed to kids and if anyone is lets stop them. Flavors are a necessary part of the experience and a big reason why they work as incentive for replacing tobacco.

 Juul is white box product and it is on the shelves where kids can see it, Juuls and menthol are the most popular vapes for kids separate from the popular flavored THC devices which is the preferred way to get high among students. The black market THC juice is branded like a candy store. Banning candy store labeled, strawberry toast flavored smoking cessation products for adults will not solve this problem.
Actually they are completely different formulas and mechanisms than what I am talking about.

You would have to show some evidence to support this claim.

Juul advertises that their exact formula as a proprietary trade secret, but for all intents and purposes it's chemically the same stuff that is sold in the little bottles.

The base formula for Juul pod juice is a 70/30 propylene glycol / vegetable glycerine ratio. (PG/VG)

The standalone vape juices sold in smoke shops contains the same base ingredients as the Juul pods, but in varying ratios. The most popular ratios seem to range from 30/70 PG/VG to 70/30 PG/VG.

The benefits of propylene glycol appear to be that it flows more easily and vaporizes at a lower temperature than vegetable glycerine, so it requires less power to vaporize.

Vegetable glycerine (which is a misnomer, since it's actually derived from fatty oils) reportedly provides a sweeter taste, but tends to be gummy and has a higher boiling point. So it can cause problems if your device can't provide enough current to vaporize it completely.

Moreover, glycerine vaporizes at 290°C (554°F), but undergoes thermal decomposition at only 280°C (536°F), creating a toxic aldehyde called acrolein. According to chemist Miroslaw Dworniczak:

For VG the boiling point is 290°C, but we have to remember that heating this compound over 280°C results in thermal decomposition – the glycerine molecule turns into acrolein, the simplest unsaturated aldehyde, having quite low boiling point of 530°C. Acrolein is a very reactive compound, toxic and irritating, especially for the eyes and skin. Every vaper experiencing dry puff should be aware of the fact that they are inhaling an amount of acrolein. This should be avoided as it is not good for our health.

The other major difference between Juul pods and some of the bottled juices sold in smoke shops, is the type of nicotine solution. Juul uses nicotine salts, as opposed to freebased nicotine more often used in other brands of vape juice. There appear to be 3 main differences between nicotine salt (NS) versus freebase nicotine (FN): the efficiency with which the body absorbs the nicotine, the dosage level, and the taste and sensation of inhaling each.

Nicotine salt is the natural state of nicotine as formed in tobacco and tea leaves. It also reportedly has a smoother flavor when inhaled, but its absorption in the human body is much less efficient than FN. If raw NS were added, a much higher dose would be required to achieve the same nicotine blood level as FN. So the salts are treated with benzoic acid in order to increase the bioavailability of the nicotine. Still, NS requires a much higher dose (20 mg and up) to achieve the same dosage as single-digit milligram dosages of FN. Note that just because this form of nicotine is more "natural," that does not necessarily make it better or less harmful to your health. But it is less irritating.

Freebase nicotine is nicotine salts that have been "freebased" by a chemical treatment with diammonium phosphate to increase its absorption in the body without the need for increased dose. It is far more easily absorbed into the body than NS, so dosages tend to be far power. But FN reportedly has a rather harsh, stinging flavor by comparison to NS. Freebase nicotine is also irritating to the skin and throat.

So the fact that Juul uses a minimal amount of VG would appear to be a good thing for their customers' health because it produces less acrolein. The fact that Juul uses nicotine salts as opposed to freebase nicotine would appear to indicate that Juul might also be less irritating than formulas that use freebase nicotine.

But most of the lung damage we're seeing might be caused by the flavoring agents, which are safe for their intended use as food additives, but may not be safe to inhale into the lungs.

I would be okay with forbidding Juul to stop advertising and selling it in convenience stores along with the big tobacco products. I typically would be against this sort of thing but this is a public health issue.

If vaping is indeed less harmful than smoking, then why should Juul be restricted from sale in convenience stores, while the more harmful cigarettes are still allowed?

I completely reject the concept that these flavors are being designed for kids.

I don't think anyone had made the argument that the flavors are expressly designed for kids per se.

But the fact remains that as nicotine delivery devices, they're undoubtedly more appealing to kids than the bitter-tasting traditional tobacco products.

And researchers in the government and in academia have discovered that these products are being marketed to minors.

this is what is used for the kind of vaping I am talking about

So you're trying to tell me that those bottles, obviously patterned after Iron Man's power suit, are not intended to appeal to kids?

this one tastes EXACTLY like toast with butter and strawberry jam. Its perfect. It also has an additional side effect, it curbs your desire to eat strawberry toast and jam, at least it does for me, much better for my diabetes which I keep trying to do better with.

That looks exactly like the kind of thing you would find in the candy aisle of 7-11.
... accidental double post
Wha??? Not the same thing? Of course they're the same thing. And what would be the difference if they weren't? They're marketed to kids the same way, and they're devices for delivering nicotine, a deadly and highly-addictive drug.

The overall basic difference that people see is that the Juul has disposable "pods", they are small and thin, yet easily kept charged. In the sense that they are both smoking gestation devices/nicotine delivery systems sure thats true but the Juul is chemically different and the heating mechanism is also different. Thew Juul is made with nicotine salts and they do not produce the same kind of vapor. They are much stronger than the stuff I use that has all the flavors you worry about. Juul only comes in 4 basic flavors which you now cant get in a convenience store. They have never had candy or cookies or sodas or science fiction names, they are basically white label. This is the thing that most kids are using and have access too, it started with a Dave chapel special. Menthol is most popular among teens especially African Americans.

From the American heart association it answers the question "Is there a difference between e-cigarettes and JUULing?" It answers No but then it goes on to say that yes there is a difference.

Is there a difference between e-cigarettes and JUULing?

No. JUULs may look different, but they're actually a type of e-cigarette. (true)

E-cigarettes are battery powered and deliver nicotine through a liquid which turns into an aerosol. (true)

The e-liquids come in fruit flavors that appeal to youth. (True but deceiving, they only have mango, fruit punch and cream as well as regular and menthol, menthol is the most popular)

JUUL is more discrete and looks like a USB drive. Other e-cigarettes may look like phones. (true, some also look like phones but the juice products im taking about look different)

Cartridge-based e-cigarettes like JUUL contain nicotine salts that do not produce vapor or visible emissions when the device is used and may make the product even more addictive. (bingo! different product, more dangerous, more addictive, these things KICK!)

JUUL claims that some of its pods have roughly as much nicotine as an entire pack of cigarettes.  (Probably true but I suspect Juul users consume more nic based on smoking habits where you rarely finish a whole cigarette and some of it gets filtered, you will finish a whole Juul pod. So a Juul pod may be more like smoking a pack and a quarter. )

this is what is used for the kind of vaping I am talking about

It uses two 18650 rechargeable lithium ion batteries (same thing used in laptops) the heat coils are replaceable, they last from a few weeks to a month and you fill the tank with the ingredients I list above. 

this one tastes EXACTLY like toast with butter and strawberry jam. Its perfect. It also has an additional side effect, it curbs your desire to eat strawberry toast and jam, at least it does for me, much better for my diabetes which I keep trying to do better with.

edit: link added above
You completely reject that flavored nicotine products are designed for kids. Fair enough. It doesn't matter who they were designed for. It matters who they are being sold to, either directly or indirectly. I have already said that I have no problem with you using this stuff. (Though it makes me sad because you seem like a nice guy and I'm sorry that you are addicted to a deadly drug.) But there is currently an epidemic of vaping by children, and flavored vape products are one of the biggest driving forces in that epidemic. And the cartels (companies) making this stuff are using very sophisticated methods of promoting their drug to kids.
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